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Judge Rules Poker is Not Gambling Under U.S. Illegal Gambling Business Act[ return to main articles page ]

By: Dan Cypra    [See all articles by Dan Cypra]
Published on Aug 21st, 2012
In breaking news, Senior United States District Judge Jack Weinstein has ruled that poker does not constitute illegal gambling under the Illegal Gambling Business Act (IGBA) in the United States. The case, U.S. vs. Lawrence DiCristina, centered on the latter's operation of allegedly illegal poker games, specifically Hold'em. He moved to dismiss the charges "on the grounds that a poker room does not fall under the definition of an illegal gambling business prescribed by the Federal statute because poker is predominantly a game of skill rather than chance." It appears that is likely the case.

Read the full opinion.

In the end, the court agreed, submitting a 120-page ruling that ended with a section that succinctly highlighted, "Poker is not gambling under IGBA." The ruling declared, "Because the poker played on the defendant's premises is not predominantly a game of chance, it is not gambling as defined by the IGBA. That the statute was targeted at limiting the influence of organized crime, and organized crime groups have operated poker games beginning in the years since its passage, does not retroactively change the statute's scope."

The ruling then declares, "Neither the text of the IGBA nor its legislative history demonstrate that Congress designed the statute to cover all state gambling offenses. Nor does the definition of 'gambling' include games, such as poker, which are predominated by skill."

You'll recall that on Black Friday, 11 individuals associated with PokerStars, Full Tilt Poker, Absolute Poker, and UB were indicted on a number of counts including operating an illegal gambling business. The misgiving is punishable by five years in prison, fine of $250,000 or twice the gross gain or loss, three years of supervised release, and forfeiture of the proceeds of the offense.

Extensive analysis in Weinstein's ruling focused on whether poker was predominantly a game of chance or a game of skill. In favor of the latter logic, the ruling read in part, "The average poker player is not so highly skilled as to take advantage of an advanced player's techniques and knowledge; yet skill, when sufficiently honed, makes the difference between winning and losing in poker."

The judge continued outlining why skill could predominate over chance in our game: "In poker… increased proficiency boosts a player's chance of winning and affects the outcome of individual hands as well as a series of hands. Expert poker players draw on an array of talents, including facility with numbers, knowledge of human psychology, and powers of observation and deception. Players can use these skills to win even if chance has not dealt them the better hand. And as the defendant's evidence demonstrates, these abilities permit the best poker players to prevail over the less skilled players over a series of hands."

PocketFives reached out to the Poker Players Alliance for comment. PPA Executive Director John Pappas responded by saying that a press release is due out in the near future. We'll have highlights of it for you right here on PocketFives.

Comments

  1. so does poker violate UIGEA since its not technically gambling?
  2. so does this mean the 11 individuals are getting off scott free?
  3. This seems like another step in the direction of getting back on the virtual felt for US players. Hopefully this ruling sets a precedent for future cases.
  4.  
    Originally Posted by lynx9292 View Post

    so does this mean the 11 individuals are getting off scott free?

    Probably not. Several have already pleaded guilty with the DOJ, and let's not forget there are counts of wire fraud, bank fraud, etc. as well.
     
    Thread Starter
  5. PPA just released their statement:http://www.scribd.com/doc/103497849/...ing-08-21-2012
  6. I check out this site on a daily basis with hopes of one day reading the headline that poker is back in the greatest country ever. As each day passes I believe this will soon be the case. This is definitely great news. (Now who the hell is Jack Weinstein?)
    Edited By: bustedbywhitey1 Aug 21st, 2012 at 09:48 PM
  7. Scott free? they just got rolled out of 731 million, plus all future profits. Wtf would u have done if the fkn joke of the US gov./ gambling fat cats, were stealing ur business? not defending it, but come on, u'd just be like, " Ya sure DOJ, here's a few bill... lol... This whole shit show is because of the fkn powerful people in America, fucking everyone over to make a buck. We should all feel lucky that is was only online money and businesses they were after, cause we all know what they`d have done had we been sitting on oil, or heroin, or minerals etc etc. Now all of a sudden it`s not illegal...once they run it... big fkn surprise here ,lmao. The worst part is that stars fkn sucks now compaired to before.... there are 5 diff `pokerstars` sites. And soon to be 5 diff FT sites. No one is getting away scott free, we all got fucked...... USA!... USA!...USA!...
  8.  
    Originally Posted by bustedbywhitey1 View Post

    I check out this site on a daily basis with hopes of one day reading the headline that poker is back in the greatest country ever. As each day passes I believe this will soon be the case. This is definitely great news. (Now who the hell is Jack Weinstein?)

    Ha, we'll see what happens long-term. Getting Federal court rulings that say that poker is a game of skill is definitely a great start.
     
    Thread Starter
  9.  
    Originally Posted by lynx9292 View Post

    so does this mean the 11 individuals are getting off scott free?


    No. They were charged when poker was considered gambling, but they are being charged for money laundering and fraud (among other things). I expect they will still have charges against them.
  10.  
    Originally Posted by bustedbywhitey1 View Post

    I check out this site on a daily basis with hopes of one day reading the headline that poker is back in the greatest country ever. As each day passes I believe this will soon be the case. This is definitely great news. (Now who the hell is Jack Weinstein?)

    Yes hopefully this will help the US players get back online, which is good for other grinders from other countries and will create more traffic.

    But who said America is the greatest country EVER. America is a great country BUT how are you defining the USA as the greatest ever, on what basis? Don't forget that your country is still seriously f***d in many ways, as this is also the view of many countries in the world. Haven't you watched the Inside Job? That movie illustrates how many Rich assholes live in your country for example.
    Anyway besides all this, there are many intelligent and respectful people in America and many areas are among the best places to live in the world. However, many of you can't help making arrogant pathetic statements about your own country which just only makes your reputation worse. How many australians do you hear saying 'Our country is the greatest ever'? for example
     
  11.  
    Originally Posted by PaulSmiley View Post

    Yes hopefully this will help the US players get back online, which is good for other grinders from other countries and will create more traffic.

    But who said America is the greatest country EVER. America is a great country BUT how are you defining the USA as the greatest ever, on what basis? Don't forget that your country is still seriously f***d in many ways, as this is also the view of many countries in the world. Haven't you watched the Inside Job? That movie illustrates how many Rich assholes live in your country for example.
    Anyway besides all this, there are many intelligent and respectful people in America and many areas are among the best places to live in the world. However, many of you can't help making arrogant pathetic statements about your own country which just only makes your reputation worse. How many australians do you hear saying 'Our country is the greatest ever'? for example

    I definitely agree with most of what you said but I love the U.S. and am mostly proud of where I come from despite the many deficiencies and fucked up things the U.S. is known for. Also, I definitely don't consider it to be anywhere close to the greatest country. Not even close.
     
  12.  
    Originally Posted by Demitrius100 View Post

    I definitely agree with most of what you said but I love the U.S. and am mostly proud of where I come from despite the many deficiencies and fucked up things the U.S. is known for. Also, I definitely don't consider it to be anywhere close to the greatest country. Not even close.

    I mean everyone knew from the get go, that this was all about money and not about the legality of online gambling... USA wasnt getting their fair share nor were 100% of players reporting taxes, so hence it's illegal. Now once they get the % they want of profits and documents of players tax info based off their profits, online gambling will now be legal and moral lol...

    just today......
  13. retroactive opinion?
    and
    holdem guys in buisness, omaha guys not?
  14.  
    Originally Posted by PaulSmiley View Post

    Yes hopefully this will help the US players get back online, which is good for other grinders from other countries and will create more traffic.
    *
    But who said America is the greatest country EVER. America is a great country BUT how are you defining the USA as the greatest ever, on what basis? Don't forget that your country is still seriously f***d in many ways, as this is also the view of many countries in the world. Haven't you watched the Inside Job? That movie illustrates how many Rich assholes live in your country for example.
    Anyway besides all this, there are many intelligent and respectful people in America and many areas are among the best places to live in the world. However, many of you can't help making arrogant pathetic statements about your own country which just only makes your reputation worse. How many australians do you hear saying 'Our country is the greatest ever'? for example

    *
    *Completely agree.....yes the country is still fcking over thier people and you call your country GREAT!!!!,,,,how about Great land of the Slaves...yup the gov't got thier 3/4 of a billion and now that they say poker is legal...what ....they just woke up and now all of a sudden its legal??????....what about 16 months ago,,,why wasn't it a game of skill then????......this is all BS and all about $$$$$ for the Gov't...not only did they Con thier own*people but the rest of the world as well...bunch of morons....they completely fooled everyone...and now we are going to*brag*about your sick mafia*Gov't.....i can tell you something there are better countries than America by a mile......and thank goodness i don't live in your part of the country because i hate to puke every day!!!!!.....BTW i hope Pokerstars says screw you mafia Gov't we are not coming back as you screwed us over but good...and will keep doing that forever!!!!!
  15.  
    Originally Posted by K5VERB View Post

    *
    *Completely agree.....yes the country is still fcking over thier people and you call your country GREAT!!!!,,,,how about Great land of the Slaves...yup the gov't got thier 3/4 of a billion and now that they say poker is legal...what ....they just woke up and now all of a sudden its legal??????....what about 16 months ago,,,why wasn't it a game of skill then????......this is all BS and all about $$$$$ for the Gov't...not only did they Con thier own*people but the rest of the world as well...bunch of morons....they completely fooled everyone...and now we are going to*brag*about your sick mafia*Gov't.....i can tell you something there are better countries than America by a mile......and thank goodness i don't live in your part of the country because i hate to puke every day!!!!!.....BTW i hope Pokerstars says screw you mafia Gov't we are not coming back as you screwed us over but good...and will keep doing that forever!!!!!


    I like this less diplomatic response! even the most advanced country in the world, still has a corrupt government!
     
  16.  
    Originally Posted by bustedbywhitey1 View Post

    I check out this site on a daily basis with hopes of one day reading the headline that poker is back in the greatest country ever. As each day passes I believe this will soon be the case. This is definitely great news. (Now who the hell is Jack Weinstein?)


    As long as internet poker is discouraged by this country. its NOT the greatest country in the world. And then even i imagine there will be much debate...
  17. Link to what this ruling may mean overall going forward legally...http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/57...39/index4.html
  18.  
    Originally Posted by PaulSmiley View Post

    Yes hopefully this will help the US players get back online, which is good for other grinders from other countries and will create more traffic.

    But who said America is the greatest country EVER. America is a great country BUT how are you defining the USA as the greatest ever, on what basis? Don't forget that your country is still seriously f***d in many ways, as this is also the view of many countries in the world. Haven't you watched the Inside Job? That movie illustrates how many Rich assholes live in your country for example.
    Anyway besides all this, there are many intelligent and respectful people in America and many areas are among the best places to live in the world. However, many of you can't help making arrogant pathetic statements about your own country which just only makes your reputation worse. How many australians do you hear saying 'Our country is the greatest ever'? for example

    It's called PRIDE, but I can understand why this is confusing to you, being from Australia that is. Kind of like when a kangaroo has a baby kangaroo and the mommy says "my kangaroo is the cutest!" Well deep down all the other kangaroo's know it's not the cutest, but they all understand why the mommy said it. And the only people who argue are the ones who have nothing better to do with their lives. Hopefully I put it into the simpliest way for you to understand, but lets not kid ourselves anymore. We all know every country has it's f****d up parts, but the United States is by far the 'greatest country ever!' Just ask the millions and millions of people on a waiting list to get into the country or you can even ask those australian women with the hair underneath thier arm pits why they pay American men to marry them just to get a visa.
  19.  
    Originally Posted by K5VERB View Post

    *
    *Completely agree.....yes the country is still fcking over thier people and you call your country GREAT!!!!,,,,how about Great land of the Slaves...yup the gov't got thier 3/4 of a billion and now that they say poker is legal...what ....they just woke up and now all of a sudden its legal??????....what about 16 months ago,,,why wasn't it a game of skill then????......this is all BS and all about $$$$$ for the Gov't...not only did they Con thier own*people but the rest of the world as well...bunch of morons....they completely fooled everyone...and now we are going to*brag*about your sick mafia*Gov't.....i can tell you something there are better countries than America by a mile......and thank goodness i don't live in your part of the country because i hate to puke every day!!!!!.....BTW i hope Pokerstars says screw you mafia Gov't we are not coming back as you screwed us over but good...and will keep doing that forever!!!!!

    WOW!!!! You act like your country does not have corrupt government!!! !!! ??? !!! Are you that naive???
  20.  
    Originally Posted by bustedbywhitey1 View Post

    It's called PRIDE, but I can understand why this is confusing to you, being from Australia that is. Kind of like when a kangaroo has a baby kangaroo and the mommy says "my kangaroo is the cutest!" Well deep down all the other kangaroo's know it's not the cutest, but they all understand why the mommy said it. And the only people who argue are the ones who have nothing better to do with their lives. Hopefully I put it into the simpliest way for you to understand, but lets not kid ourselves anymore. We all know every country has it's f****d up parts, but the United States is by far the 'greatest country ever!' Just ask the millions and millions of people on a waiting list to get into the country or you can even ask those australian women with the hair underneath thier arm pits why they pay American men to marry them just to get a visa.


    It was the greatest country, but its falling behind because of all the greedy politicians. poor education levels, unemployment and lazy people in general. Whether its conservative or liberal politicians that cant agree to anything and get anything done in Congress its all kinda fucked up on many levels. the only Bipartisan issue in our government whether its local, state or federal is looking out for themselves and setting up a nice nest-egg. Lobbyists with the biggest bankroll run the US governrment..
 
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