Okay so i have somebody who is interested in buying some of my action in the upcoming Borgata Open. I want to sell 75% of my action at 1.1 MU. The total package is $11,290. So let me see if this is right.

75% of $11,290 = $8,467.5

multiplied by 1.1 MU = $9314.25

So they would invest $9,314.25 and i would invest the difference.($1,975.75)

Now throughout the package lets say i cash for $50K total. How much do i get and what do i owe my backer?

So $12,500 for me and $37,500 for him. I don't need to pay back the orgininal $9,314.25 he invested?

Its as simple of taking 75% of my total cashes?

80/20 no cake

or if he is a really good friend or a plo balla like 70/30 at most

what is the largest amount of make up generated by a single player??

Hey guys I'm new to Pocket Fives and this is my first post. I was just wondering if I could please get your input on my situation that I'm in.
I have a $2500 bankroll and I am going out to Vegas in about 3-4 weeks to play the Venetian Deepstack Series in vegas and to grind 1/2 NL cash game.
I would like to play some of the $340 tournaments over the month span (maybe 1 or 2 a week). What is the best strategy for me to be able to play some of these in the next month? I was thinking about maybe getting a few $500-$1000 backers who are poker friends of mine and using $100 from each of the two backers and paying the rest of the buy in myself. Is this a good idea? I know i'm trying to play way out of my bankroll but I would like to play the venetian deepstacks.

Thank You All

I have been a professional online mtt poker player since officially March 2008. I have never been backed in my poker career. Due to black friday and the govt/ftp/ub holding onto (or stealing w/e you want to call it) several tens of thousands of mine I went looking for backing for the first time in my career and moved to Costa Rica. I have been abroad and playing staked for about 4 months now and I am currently in about ~12k of makeup. I play with about a $70 abi but I play everything from the 3r to the Sunday 500s on stars and party (so 12k really is nothing) but I think it may time for me to move on to a more steady life while the US govt and poker figure out its differences. I have a Masters degree and 4 years experience in the field where I would work when going back to the US.

My question is, what happens to the makeup if/when I go back to the states. My backer is a good friend, a guy I have known for 3 years, we went to the same university, I have spent the last 3 yrs with him as a roommate in Vegas for the WSOPs and he is my roommate here in Costa Rica, i know his family etc etc so walking out on him while I am in debt isnt something I want to do. He wants me to continue to grind and pay me 2k/mo upfront and add it to makeup with the plan of me grinding it out and profiting (I have been in profit twice in the 4 months where we split profits). The problem with this plan for me is when I got into poker I never wanted to be backed, its just never made sense to me for what I wanted to do. I understand it makes sense for some but for me it is something I never wanted and being in makeup and grinding out poker in todays poker economy isnt something Im sure I want to do anymore.

It is not official that I am going to put my poker career on hold (going home Dec 22nd for holidays and going to figure it out with family and friends), but if I do,what happens with the current makeup? Is the only way to actually make him whole, to continue the stake while I am in the US and play on Merge/live cash in casinos? I am new to backing, and this is his first LT backing deal also so we are both pretty new to how this works. I am looking for some advice and information. Several ppl have told me technically I am free and can just walk its the backers risk/investment that didnt work out etc but it is not the way I want it to end.

 

Originally Posted by tyson219

You could technically walk out, unless you two had an agreement that you would play for X months or until out makeup. If you did walkout, you would be obligated to offer him the chance to stake you in any future online poker games (maybe live too?). If/when poker becomes regulated and you play online in the US, you'd have to at least allow him the chance to continue the arrangement at that time.

Technicalities aside, I wouldn't walk out. Backing is a business arrangement and it gets messy when done between friends. Since your friend isn't running a large stable and this is his first LT deal, I think you need to work with him to find a mutually acceptable outcome. Whether he did this because he wants to get into backing or whether it was because he wanted to help you out, I personally think it's more important to maintain the friendship and come to some type of compromise.

Taking the 2k/mo he's offering and grinding until you're out of makeup is probably the cleanest/easiest solution. Migrating to a deal with backing on Merge/live is difficult since it will likely take longer to clear makeup and if you're not both on the same site, the money issues/reloading/profit splits/etc. can be problematic. Obviously you could probably work something like that out, but it would be unfair to him since it's a riskier deal for him, there's less profit potential and it will likely take longer to clear (especially if you're not playing full time). Personally, if I wanted to go that route, I would try to work out a deal where I could play off half on Merge/live and pay back the other half in cash once I had a full time job lined up over an X month period.

Disagree about the walking about part, unless he discussed with the backer it would only be a deal with "X" amount of months. If Mark is changing the circumstances, he can either go with what the backer is offerring or buy out the make-up. Many stables will charge 50% of make-up to get out of such a deal. The best thing would be to take the compromise unless you can't put in the time, then you should offer to buy-up the make-up. Just walking out and not giving your backer a chance to recoup make-up because you decided to move back home without any regard to repaying or playing through the make-up is more or less rolling on your backer if this deal was meant to be long-term. I assume based on what I read it was meant to be a LT deal & not a fixed amount of months and after that if I decide to move home the backer is stuck.

Mark - might want to wait for others to chime in, but if you are getting a salary and planning to play some live and online, you might want to keep that deal and not worry about it. Once you are out of make-up, you and your backer can decide what is the best line to take going forward.

If you decide to completely walk away from Poker, then you are basically free of the make-up in my opinion. You may then want to let your backer know if you ever come back, he has first option to recoup his make-up, but I am not honestly sure even if that is necesary. Curious to other opinions here.

I think you are a stand-up guy in general and just trying to figure out what are your honest options. Good luck in the future if you continue to play.

 

Originally Posted by franzia90

I have been playing poker since early 2008. This year I have started taking poker very seriously. I have been getting lessons from a coach about once a week. We get a long very well, and have been playing poker with one another for about two years. Recently he has offered to take me with him to Mexico to go play online for 3months. This is a huge decision for myself, I will be leaving college and taking the term off. I feel it is best to do this while I am young considering I never know if I will get an opportunity like this again.

He is offering to back me, I would give him 50 percent of whatever Profit I make. I am currently playing on merge by the name LetzplayforRollz. I have about 1700 games logged with about 1500 profit with an avg buy in of 6 dollars. I mostly have been playing sit n gos, with a few low stakes mtts mixed in my schedule. However the ultimate goal is to work up a large enough bankroll to be playing the majority of my schedule mtts and some sit n gos to even out a session if I am running a little cold. I see the potential in myself and so does my coach. He will be paying rent and for my poker. I will put up whatever money I can come up with to help benefit the situation for the both of us. However the terms of our staking is up in the air and I have had little experience with staking before and have had zero guidance whatsoever from anyone before in my life regarding backing and the business side of it. I trust my coach. But business is business and I would love some input from any other players who have been in a similar situation. All I want is a fair deal. For myself and my coach. Especially considering we are good friends, and I dont want poker to jeopardize a friendship. Would love some feedback.

A fair deal would be for you to split profits 50/50 and have any expenses that you are not paying multiplied by 2 and added to make-up. Coaching in many deals is free, in others its also added to make-up. If you are getting a better deal than I described you are making out well.

 

Originally Posted by franzia90

thanks for the reply wackyjaxon, seems I am making out a bit better than what u are describing.

For the love of god do not take a semester off to move to Mexico. $1,500 profit is like 1/50th of what you should have under your belt before even thinking about leaving school and moving to another country to play poker online. Is this a level?

If hes a good teacher/solid player then i think the experience will do you a world of good personally and alot of what whacky said is also other additional plusses.

Just trying to get an idea of what would be the better staking deal for the horse(me). I would be playing MTTs on Merge $60 FOs and under, 11re and under, plus the 100K Sunday on both stakes.

A- 50/50 profit(including rakeback and bonuses) and we settle at the end of every week. Make up added if i have a losing week.

B- 70/30 profit(including rakeback and bonuses) in favor of the backer, and we play 300 tournaments. If i am a loser after the 300 tournaments, makeup is forgiven and i start fresh with a new 300 set of tournaments.

Is it worth eating the 20% to have makeup reset? I mean i know at some point i'm gonna fall 2-3K in make up or something, and playing on Merge it may take a while to grind it back.

Surely long term if your a winning player option B is laughable!!

 

Originally Posted by jppp5039

Just trying to get an idea of what would be the better staking deal for the horse(me). I would be playing MTTs on Merge $60 FOs and under, 11re and under, plus the 100K Sunday on both stakes.

A- 50/50 profit(including rakeback and bonuses) and we settle at the end of every week. Make up added if i have a losing week.

B- 70/30 profit(including rakeback and bonuses) in favor of the backer, and we play 300 tournaments. If i am a loser after the 300 tournaments, makeup is forgiven and i start fresh with a new 300 set of tournaments.

Is it worth eating the 20% to have makeup reset? I mean i know at some point i'm gonna fall 2-3K in make up or something, and playing on Merge it may take a while to grind it back.

If you had not had any experience playing on Merge I would recommend option B to get used to the software, players, blind structures and tournament schedules. You have played over 1000 tourneys on Lock and know what your approximate ROI will be.

Option A is the only viable option. You just need to start grinding. If you are playing a full schedule up to $60 FOs and up to $30R you may have swings a little higher than 2-3k but if your backer can keep you funded you should be fine.

Good luck!!

80% to your backer/20% to you