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Hi All,
I am fairly new to this site and this is my first official thread. Basically, I am at my wits end with my online game. I play as much as i can live at local casinos and last year i showed a profit of around 9k which i was happy with but i just do not seem to be able to master the online game.
I play mainly at stars and have done for a couple of years without any major results. My username is Barryalaned so i would appreciate if you could take a look and give me any advice possible. I can deal with constructive crticism so do not hold back in any analysis you can provide me with. I would say i am a fairly tight player and understand variance, swings and BR management play a major role in how successful we are longterm.
I tend to play MTT's only and like to play 4-6 at a time but am i doing something wrong here? 95% of the time i get my chips in good but seem to get sucked out more often then not ( we all go through this i know ) is this something to do with me being a tighter player or am i just on the bad side of variance? How long can i run bad for is my main question i guess. I am constantly reading up on any weaknesses i can identify in my game looking for ways to improve but even when i implement them, my results are still bad.
I am truly embarrased with my online results and know i have to change but some advice from you guys and girls would be awesome!
Many Thanks
The Bazza :) -
Hi Bazza,
Sounds like typical online stuff to me. I don't like what I have observed, which is why I don't play there. I know a player who has been a pro for 25 years and can barely turn a profit online. Some will say it's variance or the computer programmes giving an edge.
My simple advice would be to play live and let the online players come to you. Where I play they are known as the worst players, and don't last very long befiore going broke. Of course there are some good players who have come from online, but generally give me online players rather than pros, semi pros and the experienced live players I come up against. -
Hi TheSquirrel,
Many thanks for your advice with this. I love to play live but can't as much as i used to due to work and family commitments so i have kind of been forced into the online game i guess. I want to become the best i possibly can in the game of poker (Like all of us i suppose) and so i am striving to improve my game online.
I have too seen some pretty sick stuff online but it happens live as well. I played The Goliath at the local casino recently which was 200k gtd and had my KK sucked out by 33 in a 247k pot. Luckily i had already made the cash otherwise i would have imploded lol.
My online record really is abysmal and i am putting that down to a real bad downswing at the moment but i am a very honest guy and probably my own worse critic so i feel i need to research where i am going wrong.
I guess i was hoping for some solid, sound advice from the more successful online players on how to go about improving my ROI etc. Whether that be increasing volume or understanding variance a little more.
Thanks again TheSquirrel and gl at the casino tables sir :) -
Thanks Bazza, anyone who can make 9k in a year gets my respect. I too would like to hear that advice from established online winning players. I saw some strange stuff live the other night too. Like god was personally at the table. However I have played with the lad a number of times, and although he is immensely likeable, is a lifetime compulsive gambler and loser. Sometimes it's hard to sit there and watch someone do nearly everything wrong and win.
Edited By: TheSquirrel Aug 28th, 2012 at 02:26 PM -
Sometimes it is just THEIR night and i try to remember that in the longterm guys like that are losers. I like players who raise light etc and just generally gamble as i can pick my spot and 9/10 i will almsot certainly take their stack but you always have that time when they suck out on you.
Poker is a game we all love and at times we all feel like quitting i guess but those that quit never win do they? I will continue grinding online and hopefully my luck will change and variance will begin to favour me!
Poker is about making that wrong move at the right time i guess :) -
Edited By: BenFaz Aug 28th, 2012 at 03:50 PMReally? Bazza has asked for his opinion about online poker not live, how to improve ect, Dont go on about how its rigged blahblah, The people who you say have been "pro" for 25 years and can barely turn are profit online are BAD. simple - Sorry for rantOriginally Posted by TheSquirrel
Hi Bazza,
Sounds like typical online stuff to me. I don't like what I have observed, which is why I don't play there. I know a player who has been a pro for 25 years and can barely turn a profit online. Some will say it's variance or the computer programmes giving an edge.
My simple advice would be to play live and let the online players come to you. Where I play they are known as the worst players, and don't last very long befiore going broke. Of course there are some good players who have come from online, but generally give me online players rather than pros, semi pros and the experienced live players I come up against.
Anyway I can see that you know your not the best which is good, because this is how i always think and will constantly trying to think how i can do something better against different opponents ect.. It will really help if you can get a few friends who play online who are winners and talk with them i am lucky i have 4-5 people i speak to on skype who are very good and will let me know where i am going wrong and how i can improve, It is best not to speak about bad beats because we know it happens.
I have been on a downswing over past few weeks my roi has gone down quite a bit, i know this and i have been working even harder and i feel that in the past few days i have been playing tons better and it has payed of and i have had alot of deep runs, another thing is to stay positive.. although its very hard to stay positive when losing tons of money but to progress with poker this is key. I cant remember how many times ive felt like just giving up but i never will because i love it and i know that i can get better and beat it.
But by looking at your stats you seem to getting deep alot your late percentage is pretty decent, My advice maybe to look at improving your game towards the end of an mtt to close it out.
GL man
Reason: Bad spelling/punctuation/grammer prob still didnt sort tho, also added a bit -
I am trying to identify my weakness during MTT's and make that stronger. Any advice is greatly appreciated so thanks for that mcandrews, i have no problem admitting my game has to change in order to improve and guys like you and Ben are exactly where i want to be.
I won't stop researching and working my ass off until i get to your level. -
Edited By: TheSquirrel Aug 28th, 2012 at 04:45 PMOh yeah - I don't wish to derail your thread but nearly every player I have observed winning a tournament, and nearly every time I've won, there has needed to be a suckout somewhere along the line. That alone is nearly enough to do your head in. Should we strive to go in behind? Buggered if I know, but I always strive to get them in ahead.Originally Posted by TheBazza1984
Sometimes it is just THEIR night and i try to remember that in the longterm guys like that are losers. I like players who raise light etc and just generally gamble as i can pick my spot and 9/10 i will almsot certainly take their stack but you always have that time when they suck out on you.
Poker is a game we all love and at times we all feel like quitting i guess but those that quit never win do they? I will continue grinding online and hopefully my luck will change and variance will begin to favour me!
Poker is about making that wrong move at the right time i guess :)
I love your attitude. I have always said the poker player's worst enemy is ego. Either thinking you are better than you are, or thinking you are being bullied and refusing to fold, no matter what, is highly dangerous to bankroll. I wish you every luck. From your few posts so far I would say you have more chance than most of succeeding. -
I am always looking to improve my game and one way I find very helpful is to read over hand histories and analysis provided by successful players. I tend to search profitable players profiles on pocketfives and swift through their threads and posts about how and why theyre playing hands a certain way. If you can uncover their thought process and lines of thinking that have made them successful, you'll be more able to implement and apply some of the same theories to your own game.
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of course every tournament winner suckouts to win , you can not win a tourny without getting lucky
Originally Posted by TheSquirrel
Oh yeah - I don't wish to derail your thread but nearly every player I have observed winning a tournament, and nearly every time I've won, there has needed to be a suckout somewhere along the line. That alone is nearly enough to do your head in. Should we strive to go in behind? Buggered if I know, but I always strive to get them in ahead.
I love your attitude. I have always said the poker player's worst enemy is ego. Either thinking you are better than you are, or thinking you are being bullied and refusing to fold, no matter what, is highly dangerous to bankroll. I wish you every luck. From your few posts so far I would say you have more chance than most of succeeding. -
I would also suggest playing the capped tournaments, your avg field size is like nearlly 4k, which is pretty insane so shipping one of those minefields doesnt happen that often!
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Dont be results oriented so if your getting it in good it will work out fine eventually. Find some people that are good players to skype with and discuss your tourney as you play. that really helped me. Also remember that stars(which I cant play as I am in USA has large fields that its hard to win sometimes, but when you win you really can pump up your Bankroll.
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Thanks to all for the comments, i appreciate all of your views and advice.
Ben - I couldn't agree more, i do need to come away from the larger field tournies as to win one of those is extremely difficult no matter what skills/ability you have.
Aggie - I will always try to get them in good where possible and will always try and study certain players etc for weakness and then exploit that.
This is a game we all love to play and we all have to be competitive as we all want to be the very best that we can. I will continue working hard on my game and keep variance at the forefront of my mind to avoid any kind of tilt. I am not one to envy those more successful then me but instead i prefer to admire and strive to be better. -
This is true, Fold Equity is your friend espcially late in MTTs and when you have a good stack near the money bubble and at the FT. try to get in the head of your opponents too. Sounds hard but with practice it gets easier. Later in MTTS get info on your opponents by checking stats if possible...
Edited By: Aggie_E Aug 28th, 2012 at 07:58 PM -
Maybe im reading a little too much into this but this line really stood out to me. If it was me i would be even more furious getting sucked out on like that in the money than out of the money. Your goal should always be to win the tourney you are playing not simply to cash.
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obviously i dont strive to get it in bad (although it may look like it ha ha) but there are times where its just mathematically incorrect to fold, or when we beat the villains range a lot of the time and this time its the top of that range
Originally Posted by TheSquirrel
Oh yeah - I don't wish to derail your thread but nearly every player I have observed winning a tournament, and nearly every time I've won, there has needed to be a suckout somewhere along the line. That alone is nearly enough to do your head in. Should we strive to go in behind? Buggered if I know, but I always strive to get them in ahead.
I love your attitude. I have always said the poker player's worst enemy is ego. Either thinking you are better than you are, or thinking you are being bullied and refusing to fold, no matter what, is highly dangerous to bankroll. I wish you every luck. From your few posts so far I would say you have more chance than most of succeeding.
if thats not happening to you your probably folding the best hand a fair bit an missing out on some big pots -
This is my main concern mcandrews, i feel i am not taking my opportunities often enough and commanding the action enough post flop!
Edited By: TheBazza1984 Aug 28th, 2012 at 08:56 PM
I can only learn to play better as i admitted i am not the best but i am a willing learner and will aways take advice from people willing to take time to give it. Slowly but surely i am improving and only time will tell once i implement new strategies as to whether or not my play improves.
Pot odds and EV are things i have studied up on a lot but as with everything, practise makes perfect! Thanks again mcandrews and to all who have posted to try and advise me on different scenarios. Run Good!! -
Of course we want to get it in with the best of it but often times this isn't the case. For example, you are deep in a tournament sitting on 16bb. It folds to the cutoff who is an aggressive player and he opens the pot. The button folds and you are in the small blind with KQ suited. We don't necessarily love our hand but with our stack our options are limited. We can't flat because of how short we are and typically regardless of your stack size it's not a good idea to flat marginal hands out of position. We know the cutoff has been active and is opening a wide range. We have a good resteal stack and fold equity so we elect to shove. The big blind folds and the original raiser snap calls with AK. Unfortunately we are dominated but our shove is +ev. We are crushing his opening range and often times when he does call we will be flipping vs a pair or a slight underdog to hands like AJ, A10. This is what I was getting at and I'm sure McAndrews would agree as well. Sometimes you have to get it in with marginal hands because it is the best move at the time. You have a good attitude and that well help. My advice is to sign up for a training site. I've been watching p5s training vids and they have helped me immensely. I'm still working on my game and have so much to improve on. The most important thing is that I can identify my leaks and work on them. I feel like poker can be related to school except that in school you graduate. With poker it is a never ending process. Best wishes and good luck at the tables sir!
Edited By: Drewdaddy19 Aug 28th, 2012 at 09:06 PM
Reason: KQ suited isn't extremely marginal but in this instance it's not a value shove because he probably wont call with KJ. -
IF your always going deep but not closing you need to do some work on your short-stack play and learn to find "spots" rather than waiting for "hands".
Edited By: elimherr Aug 28th, 2012 at 09:30 PM
Taking marginal spots to gain large chip stacks is going to help you close out more tournaments rather than just going deep.
Like some have said maybe sign up on a video training site and watch some vids.
Gl out there. -
Thanks for your input elimherr and training videos is something i am going to move on to. Closing out tournaments is definitely one of my main issues and something i need to work hard at. I can build my stack and hang around the average but this is where i begin to slowly lose my stack as i can now see i am waiting for the hands rather then picking spots to gain blinds/limpers etc.








