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can anybody explain this call please

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  1. billyboy62 billyboy62 is offline

    Darlington
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 49
    Joined: Jun 06

    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:51am)

    Ok its not a badbeat post i just want to see if anybody can explain his call if he had a huge stack i could understand it but he basically put his torny life on the line.
    pokerstars Game #13249784805: Tournament #66750634, $3.00+$0.30 Hold'em No Limit - Level XX (5000/10000) - 2007/11/15 - 01:13:21 (ET)
    Table '66750634 169' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
    Seat 1: slider2424 (304132 in chips)
    Seat 2: mjw4show (314622 in chips)
    Seat 3: jayjayme (373483 in chips)
    Seat 4: Ud$$R (130282 in chips)
    Seat 5: Billyboy62 (111976 in chips)
    Seat 6: stretch2win (156352 in chips)
    Seat 7: ITSDAROC (202082 in chips)
    Seat 8: fernandinho9 (250227 in chips)
    PokerStars Game #13249784805: Tournament #66750634, $3.00+$0.30 Hold'em No Limit - Level XX (5000/10000) - 2007/11/15 - 01:13:21 (ET)
    Table '66750634 169' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
    Seat 1: slider2424 (304132 in chips)
    Seat 2: mjw4show (314622 in chips)
    Seat 3: jayjayme (373483 in chips)
    Seat 4: Ud$$R (130282 in chips)
    Seat 5: Billyboy62 (111976 in chips)
    Seat 6: stretch2win (156352 in chips)
    Seat 8: fernandinho9 (250227 in chips)
    slider2424: posts the ante 1000
    mjw4show: posts the ante 1000
    jayjayme: posts the ante 1000
    Ud$$R: posts the ante 1000
    Billyboy62: posts the ante 1000
    stretch2win: posts the ante 1000
    ITSDAROC: posts the ante 1000
    fernandinho9: posts the ante 1000
    Billyboy62: posts small blind 5000
    stretch2win: posts big blind 10000
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Billyboy62 [Ah Qc]
    ITSDAROC: folds
    Binger [observer] said, "GOOOOO BILLLLLYYY!!!!"
    fernandinho9: folds
    slider2424: folds
    mjw4show: folds
    jayjayme: folds
    Ud$$R: folds
    Billyboy62: raises 100976 to 110976 and is all-in
    stretch2win: calls 100976
    *** FLOP *** [2d 6s 5c]
    *** TURN *** [2d 6s 5c] [9s]
    *** RIVER *** [2d 6s 5c 9s] [Ad]
    Binger [observer] said, "BS"
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    Billyboy62: shows [Ah Qc] (a pair of Aces)
    stretch2win: shows [2c As] (two pair, Aces and Deuces)
    stretch2win collected 229952 from pot
  2. d1am0ndc d1am0ndc is offline

    Posts: 2,568
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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:53am) in reply to billyboy62

    $3.00+$0.30
  3. RankMeNOW RankMeNOW is offline

    Horsham, PA
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:53am) in reply to billyboy62

    people feel they are getting bullied in blind on blind fights and he saw an A it was enough for him

    not saying it was right call by him, but you do want that call
     
  4. bassmaster bassmaster is offline SCAMMER - DO NOT TRADE

    Thailand

    Posts: 2,027
    Joined: Jan 07

    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:55am) in reply to billyboy62

    yeah its the 3.30 rebuy I usually get called all in with Jhi
  5. AFink93 AFink93 is offline

    Norwich, CT
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:57am) in reply to billyboy62

    You have 10BB's.. If it folds around to be in the SB with those stacks. Id shove any two cards there pretty much.. I think thats your answer.
  6. billyboy62 billyboy62 is offline

    Darlington
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 49
    Joined: Jun 06

    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 1:03am) in reply to billyboy62

    Up to that point we had been on the table together for 3 hours i had showdown stats of 13/14 so when i got my chips in i had a hand.The only showdown i lost i turned nut str8 and got called by flush chaser in a 400k chip pot who hit so my image was super tight.Thats why i dont really understand calling for basically his torny life there
    Thread Starter
  7. RankMeNOW RankMeNOW is offline

    Horsham, PA
    United States

    Posts: 1,166
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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 1:05am) in reply to billyboy62

    but you want this call from him.....
     
  8. Jennifear Jennifear is offline

    Niagara Falls, NY
    United States

    Posts: 10,222
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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 1:27am) in reply to billyboy62

    This is going to come as a surprise to you:

    With antes, if you are playing optimally, and shoving as many hands as you should be (which is a whooooole lot of hands), he should be snapcalling with A2o.

    You should be shoving about 65% of your hands here, and he should be calling with about 30% of his hands, of which A2o is included.

    However, against many $3 players I would not be in a hurry to make this call, because many $3 players are shoving a much, much tighter range. To me, his decision is very very close.
  9. silviodante1 silviodante1 is offline

    Warren, MI
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 1:46am) in reply to Jennifear

    please write a book
  10. RankMeNOW RankMeNOW is offline

    Horsham, PA
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 1:48am) in reply to Jennifear

    please marry me
     
  11. Stupor_Mundi Stupor_Mundi is offline

    Silver Spring, MD
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 2:05am) in reply to billyboy62

    Sooooo very standard... be glad you caught a hand. Be less glad that he sucked out.
  12. BillMueller BillMueller is offline OT President

    Farmland, IN
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 2:08am) in reply to Stupor_Mundi

    i love when ppl say "oh its a three dollar rebuy" when its well past the rebuy period....
  13. Ozzie Ozzie is online now

    Joliet, IL
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 4:05am) in reply to Jennifear

    yuwahh?? snapcall with a2 when someone with 10+bb pushes??? your last paragraph somewhat salvages this, but a looser player in this spot pushes only with 2 broadway, any ace or any pair, maybe some decent suited connectors. with a20 youre very likely looking at 25-30% or 50-55%(best case). i cannot fathom this being any kind of snapcall, especially given that this is not a sng. this looks like it's somewhere in the final 27 of a 2k+ field. another dozen or so people(if that...) and youre at the final table looking at a potential 4 figure payday. you'll probably have to gambol up at some point to get there, but this seems like an atrocious spot for it to me.

    unlike a sng, you cannot fire up the 3r again after busting here and in 25 minutes be right back in the same spot. im sure youre more than aware of this and how it should affect your willingness to gambol up. but whats more, it certainly affects your average 3r player, as you even alluded to. juding by the op's tone he was obviously not going to be pushing even 50% of his hands. his range likely has a2 destroyed.

    loose call, bb, etc. guess he thought his ace had a good shot at being ahead and wanted to gambol up.
  14. Jennifear Jennifear is offline

    Niagara Falls, NY
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 4:18am) in reply to Ozzie

    Not so fast, Ozzie. This isn't as crazy as you think.

    Potential caller is risking 101000 chips in order to win a pot of 240000. Since 101k/240k is about 42%, that's all that the caller needs against his range.

    The small blind can profitably push at least 65% of all hands. Against that range, A2o gets a virtual coinflip, a full 8% more than he needs to make the call, which is why it's a snapcall:

    <TABLE class=pptSimTable cellSpacing=0 border=1><TBODY><TR class=pptSimLabels><TH>Hand</TH><TH>Pot equity</TH><TH>Wins</TH><TH>Ties</TH></TR><TR class=oddrow><TD class=pptSpec>A2o</TD><TD class=pptEV>50.71%</TD><TD class=pptWinsHi>7,810,989,168</TD><TD class=pptTiesHi>925,826,904</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow><TD class=pptSpec>65%</TD><TD class=pptEV>49.29%</TD><TD class=pptWinsHi>7,578,016,440</TD><TD class=pptTiesHi>925,826,904</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    Against the range you suggest, which isn't that far from what many $3r players will be pushing, the decision becomes very close. (Bad call by .47%) This is why I said that the decision would be difficult under these circumstances:

    <TABLE class=pptSimTable cellSpacing=0 border=1><TBODY><TR class=pptSimLabels><TH>Hand</TH><TH>Pot equity</TH><TH>Wins</TH><TH>Ties</TH></TR><TR class=oddrow><TD class=pptSpec>A2o</TD><TD class=pptEV>41.53%</TD><TD class=pptWinsHi>2,405,439,228</TD><TD class=pptTiesHi>871,794,468</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow><TD class=pptSpec>AA-22,AK-A2,KQ-K9,QJ-QT,JT,T9s,98s</TD><TD class=pptEV>58.47%</TD><TD class=pptWinsHi>3,565,133,088</TD><TD class=pptTiesHi>871,794,468</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
  15. Ozzie Ozzie is online now

    Joliet, IL
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 6:44am) in reply to Jennifear

    as i said, and you know, not too many people have the gall here to be pushing k5. and it's not even that theyre not playing "optimally," it's that they arent playing in 9 other tournies nearing the ft bubble. so risking your tourney to steal the blinds on the hopes that the bb was dealt rags just isn't a play most in the 3r will be making here. and whats certainly more important, we can be fairly certain that based on the OP's reaction to the hand and what he told us about his tourney stats, anyone sitting with him for even a relatively brief while would likely believe his pushing range in this spot is nowhere near 65%. and his range here is what we base calling with on.
    also, im sure you dont believe the caller was likely to look at the hand anywhere near the way you look at it.

    and not that 41.5% is incorrect, but it doesnt make it seem as hopeless as either 25-30% or barely more than a coinflip if youre lucky. and thats agaisnt a fairly wide range... im usually pretty willing to gambol up, but this close to a nice score, ill pass on this spot every time. against a wide range, id call it reckless, agaisnt the op's, just awful.
  16. Jennifear Jennifear is offline

    Niagara Falls, NY
    United States

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    Nov 15th, 2007 (11/15/2007 12:17pm) in reply to Ozzie

    "we can be fairly certain that based on the OP's reaction to the hand and what he told us about his tourney stats, anyone sitting with him for even a relatively brief while would likely believe his pushing range in this spot is nowhere near 65%."

    I agree with this statement 100%. If the BB was paying attention, the optimal shoving range is not in play.
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