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Let me preface this by saying I am in NO WAY making light of the deaths of American service men and women in Iraq and Afghanistan. I just think maybe a little perspective is in order.
Some numbers to remember:
In WW1 the US lost approx. 53,402 soldiers
In WW2 the US lost approx. 291,557 soldiers
In Korea the US lost approx. 36,568 soldiers
In Vietnam the US lost approx. 58,199 soldiers
In the Gulf War the US lost approx. 529 soldiers
In Afghanistan the US has lost approx. 491 soldiers
In Iraq the US has lost approx. 4020 soldiers
(the above numbers are the "low" etimates from WW2 - Vietnam)
Cliff Notes:
All wars suck
This one sucks a lot less than most of the others in our history -
Posts: 23,112
Joined: Jan 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 4:35pm) in reply to LeftyMark
I'm pretty sure that argument is centered around fighting a pointless war and not the body count. When you're fighting a war for shits and giggles losing 1 soldier is way too much.
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 4:42pm) in reply to jtown1010
I'm fairly certain the majority of the people who are actually doing the fighting, and the military leaders that are ordering the young people to risk their lives would disagree that this is a pointless war.Originally Posted by jtown1010
I'm pretty sure that argument is centered around fighting a pointless war and not the body count. When you're fighting a war for shits and giggles losing 1 soldier is way too much.
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Posts: 2,213
Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 4:48pm) in reply to Platypus22
In WW1 the US lost approx. 53,402 soldiers
Germany expands aggressively tries to take over Europe
In WW2 the US lost approx. 291,557 soldiers
Hitler forms evil Axis, attempts to take over the World
In Korea the US lost approx. 36,568 soldiers
Communist expansion threatens to spread over the world if not checked.
In Vietnam the US lost approx. 58,199 soldiers
Again, but this time it is the Asian mainland
In the Gulf War the US lost approx. 529 soldiers
Mideast Peace and stable oil supply is threatened
In Afghanistan the US has lost approx. 491 soldiers
Attempt to bring the actual group responsible for 9/11 attack to justice,
Unfortunately, ringleader able to escape to Pakistan because ...
In Iraq the US has lost approx. 4020 soldiers
A decade previous, "they tried to kill my Daddy".
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Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 4:52pm) in reply to Platypus22
I'm fairly certain the majority of the people who are actually doing the fighting would rather be doing something else.
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 4:56pm) in reply to xTEDFORRESTx
Quote: In Iraq the US has lost approx. 4020 soldiers
A decade previous, "they tried to kill my Daddy".
No. Wrong.
How about this: The US saw an excuse/way to position ourselves in a military role smack-dab in the middle east. If we decide to wage war against radical Islam, having a stronghold in the middle of it is a pretty good start and a pretty good military move. Iran isn't likely to get out of hand because we're right down the block. Israel isn't likely to go nuts and start raining bombs on anyone because we're there to play bodyguard.
If anyone thinks the US is in Iraq because of anything else, then you're just blind and believing the bullshit you hear on tv. -
Posts: 2,213
Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:02pm) in reply to Platypus22
I think that was officially the 5th excuse to have invaded. Could you explain how overthrowing a secure non-secular government and now encouraging an unstable Islamic government to replace it is going to help fight radical Islam?
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Joined: Mar 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:02pm) in reply to Platypus22
^^^ and to protect our oil interests
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Joined: Sep 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:04pm) in reply to xTEDFORRESTx
Saddam tried to kill Hillary's daddy? link?
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Posts: 2,213
Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:06pm) in reply to BlindBuddah
^^^^ Could you expand on who the "our" is in those oil interests? I just filled up for $3.35 a gallon, should I be glad 4000 people died for that?
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Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:07pm) in reply to norcaljeff
No, Al Gore's daddy dummy.
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Joined: May 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:07pm) in reply to BlindBuddah
^^^^^^ about the oil
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Joined: Sep 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:08pm) in reply to xTEDFORRESTx
[EDIT: for tedforrest:] then you "should be glad 4,000 people died for that."
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:17pm) in reply to BlindBuddah
They (the governement) will continue to throw out excuses some of which (like the one i cited) may be true in whole or in part. They will continue to do that for as long as it takes until they feel like they've reached their objective, whether military or politically since the general public seems to be unwilling to accept the very premise of a modern day large scale war. (really, ever since Vietnam)
As for the US "unsettling" the area. That's true. They did. And I personally believe they intended to. The "unrest" is really confined to Iraq and we're already there. None of the countries around Iraq are feeling frisky because essentially we invaded one of the "better off" countries in the middle east, handed them their asses, and suffered only a small (in terms of wars) number of casualties. The unrest isn't spilling into other countries any more than in the past. -
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Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:19pm) in reply to norcaljeff
It's not about oil
It's not about Bush's daddy
It's about (see my post at the bottom of pg1) -
Posts: 256
Joined: Oct 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:20pm) in reply to Platypus22
Funny, the two "destabilizing" groups you mention are both in power due to US interference in the region. Oh wait, history doesn't matter. The U.S. encompasses everything good. Jesus loves you. Buy more cars. etc...
xTEDFORRESTx ownage. -
Posts: 23,112
Joined: Jan 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:29pm) in reply to Platypus22
It is about oil, it is about Bush's daddy, it is about big business and capitalizing on uniquely lucrative opportunities.
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Joined: Jan 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:34pm) in reply to jtown1010
It's amazing how stupid people can be.
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 5:37pm) in reply to jtown1010
It's more than all that jtown. Really. It is.
It's a big strategy. It's just too simple to say it's about Oil and Bush.
Sure, it's definately got an Oil component to it. But if you're not seeing the bigger picture, than you're not looking. -
i believe u are also one siding this in perespective u should also show the body counts of these countries weve invaded. i.e. how many iraqis have died? how many afghanistanians have died?
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Posts: 23,112
Joined: Jan 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 6:03pm) in reply to Platypus22
Well I guess I'm not looking, but this "bigger picture" that you speak of is probably consistent with the higher ranking Govt. officials making stupid profits and shipping a ton of cheese to their old school chums.
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 6:13pm) in reply to tekiller
When you go to war you look at YOUR casualty counts, not your enemies. Sad, but true.Originally Posted by tekiller
i believe u are also one siding this in perespective u should also show the body counts of these countries weve invaded. i.e. how many iraqis have died? how many afghanistanians have died?
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Posts: 22,782
Joined: Jan 07Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 6:18pm) in reply to shipitdotcom
The people who think this war was about oil or Bush's father.
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Posts: 628
Joined: Jun 06Apr 7th, 2008 (4/7/2008 6:24pm) in reply to shipitdotcom
That's an admirable stance.Originally Posted by shipitdotcom
Perspective is for people who want to ignore the details that make our lives worth living.
Completely ridiculous, but admirable.
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