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The Best US Senator - (R) Richard Lugar

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  1. The Precedent The Precedent is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 3:05am)

    http://www.foreignpolicy.com/article...man_republican

    Read the whole article. It's a great look at the history of the Republican party and its internal factional shifts. I've been told I don't post enough about the GOP or at least in positive light, so yeah.. The article centers around my favorite current Senator who happens to be a Republican.

     
    Originally Posted by TwilightOfTheWiseman

    The Republican elites of the day were conservatives, but not reactionaries; they believed in American power but also in international law and free trade. They saw foreign policy as a calling, one that demanded they serve presidents regardless of their political affiliation, which, again and again, subjected them to the charge of being opportunistic trimmers. Nothing was more important to them than the appearance of personal rectitude and service to the nation.

    Just so this OP doesn't die a quick death we need an argument. You're choice for best Senator sucks and I'm right like usual. Tea party darlin Richard Mourdoc who is attempting to primary this legend and who is actually polling well, is a testimate to the vomit inducing state of power in the GOP. If only they had more intelligent people voting in the primary.
  2. saxman saxman is online now

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 3:57am) in reply to The Precedent

    The current state of politics today is much like the current state of business. It's a heaping pile of shit. This didn't just happen overnight but has been in gradual decline over the years. The art of negotiation, and compromise seems to be a lost art. Respect is something that has also been lost.

    What makes a business strong, and what makes the political process strong is actually quite similar. It is a collection of people with varying view points who may not agree on everything but they always find a common ground to move the process forward in the best interests of their stakeholders. Whenever you create an environment whereby I win, but you lose, the outcome is seldom good in the long term. The process should always be about creating wins for both sides even though one side may win more than the other on any given issue. Allowing an adversary to save face while you get your point across or steal the moment pays dividends in future negotiations.

    Today's climate in politics is totally adversarial for the most part, as is the case with a lot of businesses. I don't know how we got here but the process is not working and it needs to change if we want to keep moving forward as a society. A rising tide floats all boats.

    btw, my favourite part of the article:

    The Republicans like Stimson who crossed party lines to vote for Cleveland in 1884 were known as Mugwumps; they find their descendents in the modern wise men who in recent years have drifted toward the Democratic Party, or at least Obama himself. Scowcroft, for example, unofficially advises Obama on foreign affairs. Powell endorsed Obama for the presidency in 2008. Asked in August whether he would reiterate his support, Powell told Face the Nation -- in what amounted to a quintessential establishment statement -- that "In the course of my life I have voted for Democrats, I have voted for Republicans, I have changed from one four-year cycle to another, and I've always felt it my responsibility as a citizen to take a look at the issues, to examine the candidates, and pick the person that I think is best qualified for the office of the president in that year, and not just solely on the basis of party affiliation."
    Edited By: saxman Oct 14th, 2011 at 04:09 AM
  3. Lenny Lenny is offline lail henny!

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 4:44am) in reply to saxman

    Please Christine ODonnell Lugar.


    And yes I respect him and mourn the state of our current politics.
  4. phish42O phish42O is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 4:47am) in reply to Lenny

    Great article... Not finished, but in before the retardation begins.
  5. norcaljeff norcaljeff is offline 2010 OT Thread Kill Leader

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:14am) in reply to The Precedent

    um, wtf is the point of that article? seriously. Lugar worked with russia to get shit done "but" Bush invaded iraq and some noble elite is going away? tf?


    sax, lol @ politics being any different than it's always been. and the quote?

    "In the course of my life I have voted for Democrats, I have voted for Republicans, I have changed from one four-year cycle to another, and I've always felt it my responsibility as a citizen to take a look at the issues, to examine the candidates, and pick the person that I think is best qualified for the office of the president in that year, and not just solely on the basis of party affiliation."

    who doesn't do this? have you ever heard prominent anyone say any differently? "I always vote for repubs even when the dem is the better man. I vote for the worst candidate as long as he's in my party!," says Larry P. Repub, former ambassador to luxembourg?
  6. saxman saxman is online now

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:22am) in reply to norcaljeff

    Different because the negative ads get tossed at you more, and the internet has opened up a whole new dimension of politking. You have hundreds of affiliated groups that are at arms length to the mainstream and make statements that the mainstream couldnt make.

    The Powell statement was interesting because i know a lot of people who only vote for one party as did their fathers. I rarely vote party, and almost always vote reps and issues. If you're saying prominent people always make that statement, idk.
  7. The Precedent The Precedent is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:25am) in reply to norcaljeff

     
    Originally Posted by norcaljeff View Post

    um, wtf is the point of that article?

    It's a reminiscing history lesson to call attention to the end of an era written for those interested in foreign policy
    Thread Starter
  8. norcaljeff norcaljeff is offline 2010 OT Thread Kill Leader

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:29am) in reply to saxman

    Ah I see what you mean about the increased access with the internets and whatnot. but vitriol is the same imo

    I'm saying I've never heard a prominent person such as powell say anything other than what he said. some reg. people vote party only fo sho

    local I'm just voting for the least extreme dem lol
    state I'm voting for a losing repub or a scumbag rino like arnold lolsigh
    national I'm voting repub because look at the insanity of the dems. kinda forced to vote party lol
    but never without looking at the people next to the R/D/I.
    jk about the I, obv. "go ahead, throw your vote away!"

    @TP can you explain the era better than the article? it talked about a bunch of shit from wayback, then said bush I had the gall to make israel do something, and now..I dunno, that's what I'm asking
    Edited By: norcaljeff Oct 14th, 2011 at 05:31 AM
  9. dolphin13 dolphin13 is offline OT Vice MVP

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:31am) in reply to norcaljeff

    Wait so in local general elections you vote for a democrat and not a republican

    I bet it's about gay rights, am I right???
    Edited By: dolphin13 Oct 14th, 2011 at 05:32 AM
  10. norcaljeff norcaljeff is offline 2010 OT Thread Kill Leader

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:34am) in reply to dolphin13

    what republican?
  11. The Precedent The Precedent is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:39am) in reply to norcaljeff

     
    Originally Posted by norcaljeff View Post

    @TP can you explain the era better than the article? it talked about a bunch of shit from wayback, then said bush I had the gall to make israel do something, and now..I dunno, that's what I'm asking

    cliffs: For all my above-the-fray GOP homies

    Thread Starter
  12. dolphin13 dolphin13 is offline OT Vice MVP

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:45am) in reply to norcaljeff

     
    Originally Posted by norcaljeff View Post

    what republican?


    Wow so republicans don't even run in general elections by you. Any links on this??
  13. The Precedent The Precedent is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 5:51am) in reply to The Precedent

    The article even talks about Ron Paul on pg 5! Where is dyzalot?
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  14. dolphin13 dolphin13 is offline OT Vice MVP

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 6:07am) in reply to The Precedent

    He hasn't yet determined what he can disagree with in this thread.
  15. norcaljeff norcaljeff is offline 2010 OT Thread Kill Leader

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 6:21am) in reply to dolphin13

     
    Originally Posted by dolphin13 View Post

    Wow so republicans don't even run in general elections by you. Any links on this??


    no one with a sniff of winning. I mean, my last choices were willie brown v tom ammiano, held my nose and went brown b/c a crooked dem is better than an insane lib, sorta, then newsome v. green party wackjob matt gonzales, then:

    "then San Francisco's progressive community attempted to find a candidate to run a strong campaign against Newsom. Supervisors Ross Mirkarimi and Chris Daly considered running against Newsom but both declined. Matt Gonzalez also decided not to challenge Newsom.[34] When the August 10, 2007 filing deadline passed, the discussion around San Francisco shifted to talk about Newsom's second term. He was challenged in the election by 13 challengers that included George Davis, a nudist activist, and Michael Powers, owner of the Power Exchange sex club"

    I mean...


    @TP "above the fray" means not really caring about israel and bowing to international law? whelp At first I thought the article was going to be good, seemed to be about not making foreign policy as political as domestic and supporting the prez. I'm all good with that (pm ahole repubs during clinton and unbelievably dirty scumbag dems under bush for how to not do this). but then...
    Edited By: norcaljeff Oct 14th, 2011 at 06:24 AM
  16. gamma21 gamma21 is offline

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 6:34am) in reply to dolphin13

     
    Originally Posted by dolphin13 View Post

    Wow so republicans don't even run in general elections by you. Any links on this??

    You don't believe politicians run unopposed sometimes? It's pretty much a complete waste of money to run against people like Nancy Pelosi? There are certain areas in the country that vote for one party no matter what. Look at the people of DC voting for Marion Barry after he was caught smoking crack with a hooker on video. David Vitter got caught with a hooker and won re-election pretty easy in Louisiana.
    Edited By: gamma21 Oct 14th, 2011 at 06:37 AM
     
  17. Dyzalot Dyzalot is online now

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    Oct 14th, 2011 (10/14/2011 3:06pm) in reply to saxman

     
    Originally Posted by saxman View Post

    Different because the negative ads get tossed at you more, and the internet has opened up a whole new dimension of politking. You have hundreds of affiliated groups that are at arms length to the mainstream and make statements that the mainstream couldnt make.

    I disagree.



     
    Originally Posted by The Precedent View Post

    The article even talks about Ron Paul on pg 5! Where is dyzalot?

    Oops! Was reading the responses first. :p

    Nevermind, I'll never make it to page five.
    Edited By: Dyzalot Oct 14th, 2011 at 03:09 PM
     3
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