Is Rivera in the discussion of the greatest pitchers of all time?

Yes. A discussion that goes like this.

Guy 1: Do you think Mariano Rivera is one of the greatest pitchers of all time?
Guy 2: Hell no.

Pedro > Everybody else in recent memory

People are always rated higher when they are the story. How often do you hear player X is the best in the league during a broadcast whether it is overall player, QB, pitcher, PG, bla bla

pedro clemens and rivera seem like a solid top 3 from the past 20 years to me... if anyone wants to argue for someone else im listening.

greg maddux, randy johnson get added to best of past 20 years, but maybe 4-5.

 

Originally Posted by SpankyHamm

Is Rivera in the discussion of the greatest pitchers of all time?

Yes. A discussion that goes like this.

Guy 1: Do you think Mariano Rivera is one of the greatest pitchers of all time?
Guy 2: Hell no.

haha this

 

Originally Posted by AMARTIN1181

yeah, good call

I Would rank them both ahead of rivera

Way to go out on a limb.

I think this thread is going to turn into this.

Q; How about (insert long time starter that will be in the HOF) being better then Rivera?
A: Oh yea, I forgot about him. Yea, hes ahead of Rivera too.

 

Originally Posted by AMARTIN1181

uhhh no, not even close to accurate, horrible post

what don't you like about spanky's post

 

Originally Posted by slizza420

Buster Olney said earlier he rated Rivera as the 4th best pitcher in baseball history.

He said it's because he basically pitched the equivalent of 2 full seasons in the postseason against the best teams in the league and still put up such ridiculous numbers.

I was surprised that he ranked him quite that high. He named two old schools guys as 1 and 2 and then Clemons at 3. Not sure where he ranks Pedro.

Buster Olney is a fantasy analyst for ESPN... i hardly care who his top 5 pitchers are of all time... with that said i think to be considered a top 5 pitcher u would need to be a starter... mariano wasnt a starter cuz he lacked the standard mulitple pitch repertoire most starters need to have to go thru lineups 3 or 4 times... he made his career and built an empire off his one signature pitch... a cut fastball... imo hes definitely a top 20 pitcher of all time maybe top 15 but to throw him in top 5 just goes to show a Fantasy mindset... relievers are usually always going to have lower ERAs then starters for the exact reason i mentioned before.. u dont have to go thru the lineup multiple times in one outing...the more pitches a hitter sees off a given pitcher the better the hitter can adapt and adjust to that pitcher... its just how baseball works...

 

Originally Posted by warden

no, he isn't.

like i'm not saying you have to respect buster olney's opinion, but he isn't a fantasy analyst. so your entire analysis of him looking at it from a fantasy perspective is based on something that isn't true.

I know man I was being overthetop cynical and sarcastic about his background when arguing for rivera being a top 5 pitcher.... i mean I dont know if you know this about him but for most of Buster's early career he covered the Yankees organization from minors to the majors and has a huge bias for rivera becuz he blossomed under his eyes as a journalist covering the team... i call him a fantasy analyst cuz thats the easiest way for me to trivialize his opinion (cuz he does in fact do fantasy work for espn) next time ill just say homer so you don't get so critical although im sure it would evoke the same response from ne1 tyring to argue something other then what the actual argument was...which is hes not a top 5 pitcher cuz he cudnt have been a starter and had the same incredible post season ERA that buster gets a hard on for in his lil soliloquies on espn,,,haha

 

Originally Posted by Magnet Steve

Guess I missed the part where "Top 3" = "No. 3", but awesome contribution.

Doesnt make any sense to say a guy is top 3 when hes clearly number 1. Factually correct I suppose but sounds pretty dumb.

Michael Jordan is a top 50 basketball player of all time.

 

Originally Posted by cocoa_butter111

are you sayin Mo Rivera is the best pitcher of all time?

Na we were talking about relievers.

But as far as all pitchers go im not sure where i'd rank Mo. In the postseason I think a stud closer is just as valuable as a #1. And Mo doesnt just go one in the playoffs. He was ready for 2 anytime the Yankees needed it.

 

Originally Posted by Pker4Dummies

No.

Why? You might only see a sp 1 time in a series.

Reliever can shorten every single game.

 

Originally Posted by JRoth15

Most #1s will throw AT LEAST twice in a 7 game series...

Thats why I said might. Rotation might not be aligned perfectly the deeper you get in the playoffs and it might not go full 7.

I guess my point is if you were to ask me who was the most valuable yankee during their 5 world series runs it would probably be Rivera and not a sp.

Also not sure why you said and even capitalized "at least" twice. How many starting pitchers start 3 games in a series? I know CC was prepared to during 09 run when Yanks where only goin with three starters in the rotation but I cant really think of any other time that was the case.

Rivera never threw more than 8 innings in a series, did it once. Threw 7 innings twice. 6.1 and 6.0. So he has thrown 6-8 innings in a series 5/33 times.