cubs are the best and you know it...thanks

All joking aside, if you want to have a serious discussion on the strengths and weaknesses of Stl, I'm sure there's plenty of us here who would love to do that. However, if you're going to respond to any negative statements with "suck a dick", then I doubt you'll get any non-hater replies.

Choice is yours. ..

 

Originally Posted by heavyj80

 

Originally Posted by CleeShay

All joking aside, if you want to have a serious discussion on the strengths and weaknesses of Stl, I'm sure there's plenty of us here who would love to do that. However, if you're going to respond to any negative statements with "suck a dick", then I doubt you'll get any non-hater replies.

Choice is yours. ..

he said "suck a fuck" ldo

and everytime i think of the central, i think of only 2 teams. i think of the astros before i think of the cards for some reason. the cards are good, but i dont think they can hang wit the brewers and especilly the cubs.

Meh, I was off by a letter. What's Ido btw?

When I think of the Central, I actually think of the Reds. For some reason I hate when my team plays them. I look at them and on paper they should be a great team. A dominant closer, a few solid SPs (Harang/Volquez are v good and Arroyo/Cuerto seem fine), a great lineup filled with speed, and decent defense. Why are they so awful?

wtf are you talking about. you do realize the only reason the brewers are getting headlines is because they picked up Sabathia, right? The Cubs are clearly the superior team, not by a lot, but they are better. And they're obv going to get a shitload more attention in the national media because they are a bigger market nationwide.

With that said, I don't think the Brewers are much better than the Cards, the Cards have overachieved all season long - yet I think they're a bit underrated also. If they get a lot better by the return of Wainwright/Carpenter, then they can definately compete down the road. But, they still won't get the attention. If you know anything about baseball, you would know that.

fwiw, weve grown up together and im just giving him shit as i obviously root for the cardinals and it was an inside joke that you took a bit to serious. Gl in your stress-filled and dick sucking life

With two pitchers coming off of major arm problems as your aces down the stretch, I'd be a little concerned. Of course there is the possibility that they both come back fine and get right back into the groove they had prior to injury. However, it also might take them 3-5 starts a piece to get back in form, and in a race this close those 6-10 games could mean a LOT.

Obviously I'm concerned with the back end of their bullpen. Franklin started to get lit up towards the end of his closing duties and Izzy has been rough this year. That's something that will need to step up in order to make a push.

Their lineup is good. Ludwick is playing out of his mind and Pujols is Pujols. Will that elbow hold up all year? Who knows. Ankiel has had a phenomenal year thus far, and his story is one of the few in sports which makes me legitimately smile.

As for your points on why everyone talks about the other teams in the division, Jpitt explained it well. The Brewers made a huge trade and Chicago is, well, Chicago. Coming from a fellow fan of a team that doesn't get the respect it deserves, don't let that bother you though. Media attention does not equate to wins.

 

Originally Posted by H@BB@KUK

fwiw, weve grown up together and im just giving him shit as i obviously root for the cardinals and it was an inside joke that you took a bit to serious. Gl in your stress-filled and dick sucking life

I fail to see how asking OP if he wants to discuss StL or just tell us how great they are equates to my life of sucking dick. As for someone taking things too seriously ...

 

Originally Posted by JayAces

you answered your own argument with the phrases

"Kyle Lohse is our third starter" and "2005 Cy Young winner" (Its 2008 now, shhh)

Hey Chicago what d'ya say, Cubs are gonna sweep the Brewers today

bwahahahahhaha

yeah.. a cubs fan cant imagine having a guy 13-3 as your ace, much less a third starter

 

Originally Posted by CleeShay

With two pitchers coming off of major arm problems as your aces down the stretch, I'd be a little concerned. Of course there is the possibility that they both come back fine and get right back into the groove they had prior to injury. However, it also might take them 3-5 starts a piece to get back in form, and in a race this close those 6-10 games could mean a LOT.

Obviously I'm concerned with the back end of their bullpen. Franklin started to get lit up towards the end of his closing duties and Izzy has been rough this year. That's something that will need to step up in order to make a push.

Their lineup is good. Ludwick is playing out of his mind and Pujols is Pujols. Will that elbow hold up all year? Who knows. Ankiel has had a phenomenal year thus far, and his story is one of the few in sports which makes me legitimately smile.

As for your points on why everyone talks about the other teams in the division, Jpitt explained it well. The Brewers made a huge trade and Chicago is, well, Chicago. Coming from a fellow fan of a team that doesn't get the respect it deserves, don't let that bother you though. Media attention does not equate to wins.

good points.. first one though, carpenter came back and pitched well especially in the later innings of his outing. and wainright really had nothing wrong with him that would seriously change his pitching ability when he comes back. he had some freak break in the tip of his finger, it's not as if he messed up his shoulder.. so i really dont see it taking him long at all to get back into the swing of things.. point two.. late innings relievers are looking rough but izzy came through with a good outing today and if he keeps throwing like that we'll be fine there (btw i wish jockety was still around he would have picked up a closer before the deadline) ... point three... you're right. lineup is good but i dont think ludwick is playing out of his mind.. look at his minor league stats.. and four.. you're completely right. and that's what this post is meant for.. to let people know that we are still here and just because we arent getting the media attention doesn't mean we're not in this race

your opinion no longer matters for anything if you really believe any of the equations that you listed.

At least be realistic, we just swept their asses in Milwaukee

carpenter wont he cy young last time he pitched.. i would think if zambrano was better he would have won the cy young.. hmm

i honestly dont know a whole lot about harden since he just now got to the nl.. but wainright is a hell of a pitcher and would bet that he's just as good

now lilly vs lohse lets see...
lohse 13-3 3.68 era 1.27 whip
lilly 10-6 4.49 era 1.34 whip

 

Originally Posted by JayAces

so with carpenter you use the past, with lohse you use the present, and you plead ignorance with harden.

keep digging that hole

hmm well in the present.. carpenter gave up only 1 run in his first start in over a year.

and my bad i dont follow the a's and their pitching staff. i watched a cubs game the other day and he threw well but didnt blow me out of the water

so with realistic equations

Healthy Carpenter > Zambrano
Wainwright = Harden
Lohse > Lilly
Wellameyer < Dumpster
4 year old neice > Marquis

oh two more equations

10 World Series Titles > 2 World Series Titles
2006 > 1908

 

Originally Posted by CleeShay

 

Originally Posted by Big Ends

carpenter wont he cy young last time he pitched.. i would think if zambrano was better he would have won the cy young.. hmm

i honestly dont know a whole lot about harden since he just now got to the nl.. but wainright is a hell of a pitcher and would bet that he's just as good

now lilly vs lohse lets see...
lohse 13-3 3.68 era 1.27 whip
lilly 10-6 4.49 era 1.34 whip

I agree that Carpenter circa 2005 > Zambrano today. If Carpenter can return to form, then I'd agree that Stl has the advantage with the number 1. However, Carpenter is in a similar boat as the ace of my team - Josh Johnson. They both were great a few years ago prior to injury, and they both have pitched well since returning from injury. But it takes more than a few games to see how they respond to the workload of being back in the full swing of things.

Wainwright IS a hell of a pitcher. He's been great for the past few years and has some nasty stuff. Unfortunately - or fortunately... depending on your side - Rich Harden is just ridiculous...when healthy. Harden has some top 3 stuff (Haren>Santana>Harden 1,2,3 imo) and can just flat out dominate anyone. The problem is that he is very injury prone, and you really have to worry about overworking him.

Say what you want about Dempster, but he has been ridiculous this year. Yes, so has Loshe, but Dempster has been near unhittable. Both of them have had difficulties in the past, so I think it's alright to compare them together. I think I'd have to give an edge to Dempster RIGHT NOW, but that margin is so small that it could switch as early as tomorrow.

Looper is pitching solid and Lilly is struggling.

All in all, it seems like a pretty even pitching matchup starter-wise with a slight, SLIGHT edge to ChC.

Note: This is assuming Carpenter and Wainwright return to form. If not, it's pretty lopsided.

Edit: Missed Wellemeyer. That's probably a good thing for the Cardinals though .. they should forget him at the next airport.

thank you for giving real points with explanations instead of saying oh if you believe that you're useless. and this whole argument isnt even about who has a better pitching staff.. it's that everybody has ruled the cardinals out from the begining but we have a VERY solid lineup, experience, best manager in baseball, and best fans in baseball so we are very much in this race

 

Originally Posted by JayAces

Heres my math

Zambrano > Carpenter (no question)
Harden > Wainwright (no question
Lohse = Lilly
Dempster > Wellemeyer
Marquis = whoever you got

HA definately done arguing with a baseball illiterate piece like you.. your team just played milwaukee and bush pitched for them on wednesday dumbass.. dont argue that your team is better than mine if you dont even know who's on my team