Originally Posted by Underdog34

Everybody keeps telling me that this plan kills private insurance. To quote Willywoo: saying it doesn't make it so. The only thing that will kill private insurance is if the public plan is so much better that everyone chooses it over private insurance, in which case, um, great. Better, cheaper insurance for everyone. Sweet.

God this makes my head hurt so freaking bad. No offense to you personally, but this post exemplifies the primary problem with Democrats and their lack of understanding of business and economics.

It is so painfully obvious that the government has no cost constraints and can put the private sector out of business by either jacking up taxes on the top bracket, or by simply running up the deficit.... and since this is what the current government wants, so they will. Once private insurance is eliminated, the government monopoly will control everything... and since we have historically seen every single time that government-controlled enterprises are run much less efficiently and effectively than privately run ones, the "better" insurance that you claim (which was never better to begin with, it was just priced artificially cheaper to eliminate the private sector) will be a massive fail for everyone. It's why we have the Sherman Anti-Trust Act for the private sector, which the Justice Department enforces. Only it can't enforce it against the government itself.

As Willywoo said, "easy game". A game where everyone loses. If you cannot see that from the evidence provided in this thread from intelligent arguments, then I believe you to be blindly following Obama like the other zombies.

 

Originally Posted by Underdog34

�If government-run health insurance is so bad, then why not eliminate Medicare?� It's 100% government-run health insurance.� Yesterday a Congressman brought up an amendment that would have eliminated Medicare.� Not many Republicans voted for it.� Why not?

Maybe because disenfranchising the older and fastest growing demographic is political suicide? This is politics that drive who our representatives are, correct? Elections matter, didn't you say? Maybe the "best" doesn't always equal the most "politically expedient", hmmm? What do you think Jon?

But since you bring up Medicare, you bring up an example of a program that is popular with individuals in a demographic, which will be highly difficult to remove once implemented. Like someone said this week, people don't like to give up their free things. So who wants to be the politician to rescind a failed Obama health care plan later, when they will have to take free things away from citizens who are enjoying them? Ahhh, the slippery slope of politics vs. effectiveness again. Medicare is a shitty program that no Congressmen can justifiably argue against, strictly because it would destroy them politically. Funny how that works isn't it?

But nice deflection attempt, and keep em coming. And thanks for making it quite clear in this thread what you really want - government-controlled health insurance. I was pretty sure that you knew the "public option" was a means to an end..... and that a lot of these arguments you have purported were coming from a wolf in sheep's clothing.

WP sir.

 

Originally Posted by ginwilly

why medicare will not be abolished;

old people vote in higher percentages than any other demographic, and politicians want re-election first, every thing else 2nd.

Wouldn't it be better for old people to have a system that worked better? Or are they too stupid to realize that Medicare is actually bad for them, unlike you and others like you? Who are the elitists again?

 

Originally Posted by Underdog34

 

Originally Posted by ginwilly

why medicare will not be abolished;

old people vote in higher percentages than any other demographic, and politicians want re-election first, every thing else 2nd.

Wouldn't it be better for old people to have a system that worked better? Or are they too stupid to realize that Medicare is actually bad for them, unlike you and others like you? Who are the elitists again?

this doesn't work man but C for effort anyway. So what you are saying then is that a system that they have been forced to pay into their whole lives should be taken away for something they know nothing about, have only heard how bad it will be, have heard they are targeted as the cost burden, have heard that end of life is the most expensive part of healthcare and this is where we need to make the most cuts.

no, if you think old people are stupid then you are an idiot, there is wisdom in years that we simply can't have yet.

point to one time i said medicare is bad for the elderly or shove that elitist statement please thank you. I may have said it's a government clusterfuck that is inefficient and huge waste of time and money that could be better used, but i never said it was bad for the elderly, the alternative of what's presented is obviously what is bad.
you elitist geriacaphobe

 

Originally Posted by resilient

I did notice that you ignored my mention of political expedience vs effectiveness though.

I think I might agree with you on this. One of the reasons I support the current legislation is not because I think it is the BEST SOLUTION EVER, but because I think it's a pretty good solution that can also actually get passed. Pragmatism and all that.

 

Originally Posted by ginwilly

you elitist geriacaphobe

A real honest-to-goodness LOL! Almost spit Diet Coke on my keyboard. wp.

Oh Doug, don't you get it? We agree on WAAAAY more than we disagree on. Now, cmon, take my hand and let's sing.

Kum ba yah, governmentrunhealthcare

Kum ba yah.

Kum ba yah, publicoptionthatdestroysprivatehealthinsurers,

Kum ba yah.

Kum ba yah, growingmajorityofvotersinthralltodemocrats,

Kum ba yah,

Oh greatsocialistutopia, kum ba yah.

Wasn't that nice?

 

Originally Posted by Underdog34

Oh Doug, don't you get it? We agree on WAAAAY more than we disagree on. Now, cmon, take my hand and let's sing.

Kum ba yah, governmentrunhealthcare

Kum ba yah.

Kum ba yah, publicoptionthatdestroysprivatehealthinsurers,

Kum ba yah.

Kum ba yah, growingmajorityofvotersinthralltodemocrats,

Kum ba yah,

Oh greatsocialistutopia, kum ba yah.

Wasn't that nice?

lol, sweet

ahhh yes, Medicare, that shining bastion of govt-run healthcare - after looking at Medicare, I can't imagine why anyone wouldn't want the gov't to have even more control over healthcare