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Article: Lose the Battle, Win the War

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  1. Dan Dan is offline Administrator

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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 7:59pm)

    You can view the page at http://www.pocketfives.com/content.p...le-Win-the-War
     
  2. Rycky4Golf Rycky4Golf is offline

    Houston, TX
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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 8:15pm) in reply to Dan

    Prolonging the bubble in a SNG might be similar also, depends how you look at it.
  3. killingbird killingbird is offline

    Cary, NC
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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 8:31pm) in reply to Rycky4Golf

    great article. Recently had a situation in a shorthanded cash game that was nice and fishy. Game is 1/3 and the shortest player had ~$50. It was pretty apparent that when this guy busted the game was going to break because people were talking about how they did not want to play 4 handed. So i opened and folded to several of his shoves where I absolutely should have called. But i was not interested in his $50. I was interested in the stacks of the other players who all had $300 plus. So i let him have the pots to keep the game running and ended up winning a nice bit more than $50 as a result. Eventually the shorty did bust, and the game broke as expected.

    Again, nice article Court!
     
  4. Plastic water Plastic water is offline

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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 10:34pm) in reply to killingbird

    Friends checking out the nuts is not cool,good rule .why would anyone intentionally not bet the nuts on river,because they jus t know they won't get called and want info instead. .this can't be serious.
  5. CharlesD1ck CharlesD1ck is offline Scammer & Thief - Do NOT Trade

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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 11:03pm) in reply to Plastic water

     
    Originally Posted by Plastic water View Post

    Friends checking out the nuts is not cool,good rule .why would anyone intentionally not bet the nuts on river,because they jus t know they won't get called and want info instead. .this can't be serious.

    Well, first off, are YOU serious? If you are any sort of good poker player seeing someone's cards is the best information you can get. If you have the absolute nuts, and know the guy is never calling a river bet (say you had him pegged on a draw that missed) why wouldn't you check to see what he called 2 streets with? Depending on the person, and how the action played, I opt to take the penalty from time to time just to know what the guys range is. Sure, I have to miss a few hands, but next time I am in a pot with that guy I have a much better idea of A.) his pre flop range B.) What kinds of hands he is willing to call flop and turn bets with and C.) the sizes of bets I can get away with to get max value
  6. yjbrewer yjbrewer is offline

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    Aug 3rd, 2012 (8/3/2012 11:59pm) in reply to CharlesD1ck

    In cash games if a person is raising alot i like to call to get am idea about his range. I play loose my first buy in to give perception of being a donk. Then i get in a big hand with the nuts and everyone is 3 betting me. I like staddling from button and cutoff too. People get tired of you doing it and they raise light and then u wake up with Aa and 4 bet and we have a party.
  7. Tilted0o Tilted0o is offline

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    Aug 4th, 2012 (8/4/2012 12:52am) in reply to CharlesD1ck

     
    Originally Posted by CharlesD1ck View Post

    Well, first off, are YOU serious? If you are any sort of good poker player seeing someone's cards is the best information you can get. If you have the absolute nuts, and know the guy is never calling a river bet (say you had him pegged on a draw that missed) why wouldn't you check to see what he called 2 streets with? Depending on the person, and how the action played, I opt to take the penalty from time to time just to know what the guys range is. Sure, I have to miss a few hands, but next time I am in a pot with that guy I have a much better idea of A.) his pre flop range B.) What kinds of hands he is willing to call flop and turn bets with and C.) the sizes of bets I can get away with to get max value

    If a guy isn't going to call any bet, and has a hand that going to lose to literally everything (like a missed draw does), it's almost certain that he's going to muck his hand, are you going to ask the dealer to reveal his hand and be that jackass?

    Not betting the nuts on the river just seems ridiculous... You are never 100% sure he won't call.
  8. CharlesD1ck CharlesD1ck is offline Scammer & Thief - Do NOT Trade

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    Aug 4th, 2012 (8/4/2012 1:23am) in reply to Tilted0o

    If he made the last aggressive action and has to show his hand if I ask I most certainly will be THAT guy. A draw was just an example. There are plenty of instances where someone may have the 3rd or 4th best hand and wouldn't call a bet, but will happily flip at show down. I wasn't under the impression that you played poker to make friends, I thought it was taking advantage of any and every bit of info you could get.

    "Not betting the nuts on the river just seems ridiculous... You are never 100% sure he won't call."
    True, you never know what some people will call w/, but if you have any sort of a good read you know about how often he will call. There is a time and place for everything, feel free to step out side of the box any time.
  9. ToNiSiNz ToNiSiNz is offline

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    Aug 4th, 2012 (8/4/2012 4:43am) in reply to CharlesD1ck

     
    Originally Posted by CharlesD1ck View Post

    If he made the last aggressive action and has to show his hand if I ask I most certainly will be THAT guy. A draw was just an example. There are plenty of instances where someone may have the 3rd or 4th best hand and wouldn't call a bet, but will happily flip at show down. I wasn't under the impression that you played poker to make friends, I thought it was taking advantage of any and every bit of info you could get.

    "Not betting the nuts on the river just seems ridiculous... You are never 100% sure he won't call."
    True, you never know what some people will call w/, but if you have any sort of a good read you know about how often he will call. There is a time and place for everything, feel free to step out side of the box any time.


    Even if there is a 10% chance your river bet (with the nuts) will be called that value gained is much more valuable then the knowledge gained by checking back the nuts and getting to see your opponents hand.
     
  10. JLizard JLizard is offline Grand Zu Wizard in Training

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    Aug 4th, 2012 (8/4/2012 5:41pm) in reply to ToNiSiNz

    If there is any possible informational edge to be gained by checking the nuts on the river then I agree the rule could be stopping this and is maybe bad . But I'm sure you agree the spots would be very rare and it may prevent some forms of soft play among friends. So I don't know if its better to stop the information or stop the soft plays . Good read . Thanks!
    Edited By: JLizard Aug 4th, 2012 at 05:43 PM
     61
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