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<H1> <H1>Hand Details</H1>
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<TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Hand Number</TH><TD>973542332</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Start Date</TH><TD>2007-11-07 00:03:11</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>End Date</TH><TD>2007-11-07 00:04:57</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Pot Size</TH></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Rake</TH><TD>$3.00</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Game Type</TH><TD>Omaha</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Play Mode</TH><TD>Real</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Table Name</TH><TD>Trax</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Structure</TH><TD>PL</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH vAlign=top align=left>Table Stakes</TH><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=290 border=0><TBODY><TR><TH align=left>Min Bet</TH><TH align=left>Max Bet</TH><TH align=left>Ante</TH><TH align=left>Blinds</TH></TR><TR><TD>$4.00</TD><TD></TD><TD>$2.00</TD><TD>$4.00</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TH align=left>Community Cards</H> <TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <H2>Player Information</H2> <TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR class=headings><TH>Screen
Name</TH><TH>Seat
Position</TH><TH>Cards
Dealt</TH><TH>Start
Amount</TH></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>1 </TD><TD>A
3
5 A
</TD><TD>$629.00</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>2 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$383.00</TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>3 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$815.90</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>4 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$450.50</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>5 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$183.00 </TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>6 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$208.00</TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>7 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$299.18</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>8 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$1,318.00 </TD><TD></TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>9 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$766.90</TD><TD></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <H2>Hand Actions</H2> <TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR class=headings><TH>Player</TH><TH>Action</TH><TH>Action Data</TH><TH>Timestamp</TH></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Set dealer/Bring in spot </TD><TD>1 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Ante/Small blind </TD><TD>$ 2.00 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Big blind/Bring in </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD>A 3 5 A </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:35 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:50 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 2.00 </TD><TD>00:03:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 8.00 </TD><TD>00:04:17 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 38.00 </TD><TD>00:04:33 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 38.00 </TD><TD>00:04:36 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 158.00 </TD><TD>00:04:40 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>All-in </TD><TD>$ 141.00 </TD><TD>00:04:43 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></H1>
What's my play? Seraph has been playing pretty agressive.....and zaatar is all in for less than 1/2 buy in.....Is this a spot where you fold AA preflop because of how bad my other two cards are?
edit - deleted community cards -
you called trying to trap them for another raise pre right? So re-pot that shit all day and hope seraph either folds or puts the rest of it in.
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Posts: 4,965
Joined: Feb 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 9:56am) in reply to EddieO
I probably would have rebumped this pot here. I am not an omaha expert by any means, but the majority of the time someone here is holding KKxx...Other players are probably paired and double suited. If you flat call you will most likely fold to that board if someone makes a big bet b/c all you have is a draw for a straight (which is not usually good in omaha) and a pair of Aces.
Someone could have a set @ this point with a flush draw which would have you burried. If you repop pre-flop than people holding crap pairs will fold, someone holding KKxx (if shortstacked) will call.
The only other hand I would worry about here would be AK10Q....something to that nature who would def. call in that spot for the proper odds. I don't think Serph is holding this hand here seeing what you said previously...very aggro throughout the game. Granted you might get a call from him, but normally you would be ahead of his range here just by going on your facts
Like I said, I am no Omaha expert, I do watch the game and fairly understand what it going on. But that is a shove in my opinion here.
Curious to see what you did, and I'm sorry I'm no expert.
Just my $.02
KoJacks -
Posts: 702
Joined: Feb 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 10:30am) in reply to kojacks
I disagree with the KKxx
I actually like your two cards 35h. Means low cards will usually ship the victory. I'm poppin this here too, but Im not very good at omaha. I wouldn't be surprised if one of them also had AA and another a combo draw so you are probably in bad shape. But thats the worst worst case scenario.
sturge -
Posts: 32
Joined: Nov 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 10:50am) in reply to DexterCain
Careful your wonderful Aces are not cross-suited. Against a wild player I like to bump it with all the advantages. In these smaller games you could just get called down, post flop play is the key with your hand. This is Omaha and you ONLY have Aces preflop.
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Posts: 1,635
Joined: May 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 10:54am) in reply to BorgataPro
care to give an answer as to what you would do then in this spot? really can't play post flop once i build a $400 pot pre flop....its pretty much fold or shove in my mind. As you can see I called the $38 bet hoping to play post flop but that is no longer an option here. Fold or shove?
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Posts: 32
Joined: Nov 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:03am) in reply to EddieO
Shove
I do not like to build very large pots preflop in Omaha to begin with. Omaha pros can chew up an erratic player while MINIMIZING RISK much easier than Holdem. I'm saying DO NOT PLAY PLO LIKE NLH. Good luck I think PLO is the most profitable (risk adjusted, variance) game around. Keep playing. -
Posts: 462
Joined: Nov 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:05am) in reply to EddieO
If you play well, then the standard play here is to go broke. So, I would ship it instantly and not worry about the results of what may happen.
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Posts: 616
Joined: Oct 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:05am) in reply to EddieO
If you have AAxx plo and you can get it all-in pf, you should.
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Posts: 665
Joined: Jun 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:47am) in reply to EddieO
Fold to the first raise.
You don't have any suited aces.
By calling, you're giving more incentive for theseraph to push because of the dead money in the pot and zaatar most certainly has the other 2 aces for your outs. Seraph most likely has rundown cards and therefore has the greatest equity in the pot against the two AAxx hands.
This is a spot that is -ev because of a multiway pot with unsuited aaxx.
Example scenario
<pre>http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3878916
pokenum -mc 500000 -o ad 3h 5h as - 6s 7s 8h 9h - ac tc ah 4h
Omaha Hi: 500000 sampled boards
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
As Ad 5h 3h 50939 10.19 352855 70.57 96206 19.24 0.198
7s 6s 9h 8h 235816 47.16 264184 52.84 0 0.00 0.472
Ac Tc Ah 4h 117039 23.41 286755 57.35 96206 19.24 0.330
</pre>You're getting 339 to 120 to call.
This is a +EV call as long as your EV is higher than .26
Before you called the 38$ tho, the pot odds to call are 52 to 34 so you need to have at least a .39 equity for this to be neutral EV and you also got to keep in mind that because you are not closing the action, seraph can easily see you as dead money and shove.
With such a weak aaxx holding, really the only play you can make in that spot is repot or fold. You are never going to flop anything you like, calling that first raise is the worst possible play in that spot. There is probably going to be heavy action on the flop given the preflop actions.
Once you called the first raise however, it is a judgement play based on your reads of what zaatar's range of limp reraising is. If he only does this with aces, this is a very easy fold. If he does this with very wide range of hands, you're priced in to call. Seraph almost never has aaxx given his min raise play. Seems like he's trying to get value out of a hand that flops very well like a rundown double suited or 2 pair double suited. -
TheOmaholic
Do NOT Trust - Scammer
Posts: 1,957
Joined: Aug 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:48am) in reply to kojacks
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TheOmaholic
Do NOT Trust - Scammer
Posts: 1,957
Joined: Aug 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:51am) in reply to Zefa
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Posts: 462
Joined: Nov 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:53am) in reply to Zefa
lol, what omaholic said
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GambleAB
1. I'm awesome
Posts: 5,493
Joined: Apr 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 11:59am) in reply to EddieO
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Posts: 462
Joined: Nov 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:21pm) in reply to GambleAB
hence my intial reply :-)
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Posts: 665
Joined: Jun 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:39pm) in reply to TheOmaholic
Uh no.
My logic is fold preflop because there are more situations where this is -EV than there are where this is +EV.
As I stated in my post, it is very read dependant on the players. There are a lot players I have notes on that play 35/5 or something similar and will NEVER repop excep with aces. Limp reraising is by a medium stack is also the most standard play with AAxx.
The only definate statement that I made and will stand by is that you fold this holding to the 38$ initial raise. AA35 with 3 5 of hearts rarely flops well and with one of the players having not even a full stack, you can't justify a call with implied odds.
I never said fold to the 120 raise in the definate sense. I stated it was read dependant and given the only information I had was that TheSeraph was aggressive, it's not much to go on. If he's an aggro spewtard, then its probably a call because he could be isolate pushing with any four decent cards. If he's aggro + solid, he's probably doing this with a hand that will have a very strong equity against two AAxx hands.
The other player who limp reraised also could be a donkey who just wants to shove any 4 decent looking hands or he could be a tight solid shortstacker who plays a 30/8 game and only limp reraises aaxx there.
"Fold preflop because there are certain situations where you may be in a -EV spot"??? This statement so redundant and doesn't say anything.
There are obviously certain situations where having KK preflop is a -EV spot. Yea... when your opponent is holding aces. But the majority of the time, having KK preflop is +EV because in an infinite samplesize of having KK, it will earn you money/chips.
So don't twist around what I'm saying into a ridiculous statement. I'm saying this IS a -EV spot because given the opponents hand ranges and pot odds, in an infinite sample size of being in this spot, it is borderline breakeven to a losing play. -
Posts: 1,635
Joined: May 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:40pm) in reply to myzislow
<H1>I thought about repotting the $38 an prob should have, but I shoved it anway.....i might have been slightly off on my play - but i just wanted to make sure shoving there was not the absolute wrong move. thanks for the input.
Hand Details</H1>
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<TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Hand Number</TH><TD>973542332</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Start Date</TH><TD>2007-11-07 00:03:11</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>End Date</TH><TD>2007-11-07 00:04:57</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Pot Size</TH><TD>$1,440.00</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Rake</TH><TD>$3.00</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Game Type</TH><TD>Omaha</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Play Mode</TH><TD>Real</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Table Name</TH><TD>Trax</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH align=left>Structure</TH><TD>PL</TD></TR><TR class=padding><TH vAlign=top align=left>Table Stakes</TH><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=290 border=0><TBODY><TR><TH align=left>Min Bet</TH><TH align=left>Max Bet</TH><TH align=left>Ante</TH><TH align=left>Blinds</TH></TR><TR><TD>$4.00</TD><TD></TD><TD>$2.00</TD><TD>$4.00</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TH align=left>Community Cards</H> <TD>9 2
4 7 8 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <H2>Player Information</H2> <TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR class=headings><TH>Screen
Name</TH><TH>Seat
Position</TH><TH>Cards
Dealt</TH><TH>Start/End
Amount</TH><TH>Total
Bet</TH><TH>Win/Loss
Amount</TH></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>1 </TD><TD>A 3 5 A </TD><TD>$629.00/$0.00 </TD><TD>$629.00 </TD><TD>$-629.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>2 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$383.00/$381.00 </TD><TD>$2.00 </TD><TD>$-2.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>3 </TD><TD>J 10 7 9 </TD><TD>$815.90/$1,626.91 </TD><TD>$629.00 </TD><TD>$811.01 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>4 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$450.50/$450.50 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>5 </TD><TD>Q A A Q </TD><TD>$183.00/$0.00 </TD><TD>$183.00 </TD><TD>$-183.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>6 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$208.00/$208.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>7 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$299.18/$299.18 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>8 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$1,318.00/$1,318.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>9 </TD><TD></TD><TD>$766.90/$766.90 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD><TD>$0.00 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <H2>Hand Actions</H2> <TABLE class=info cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR class=headings><TH>Player</TH><TH>Action</TH><TH>Action Data</TH><TH>Timestamp</TH></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Set dealer/Bring in spot </TD><TD>1 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Ante/Small blind </TD><TD>$ 2.00 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Big blind/Bring in </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD>A 3 5 A </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD>J 10 7 9 </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD>Q A A Q </TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>Card dealt to a spot </TD><TD></TD><TD>00:03:11 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>Cosmic Power </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:35 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:50 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>hunkrock </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>plasterblaster </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>jjbrut </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>socrstud013 </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 0.00 </TD><TD>00:03:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 4.00 </TD><TD>00:03:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>ShortBusBully </TD><TD>Fold </TD><TD>$ 2.00 </TD><TD>00:03:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 8.00 </TD><TD>00:04:17 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 38.00 </TD><TD>00:04:33 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 38.00 </TD><TD>00:04:36 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Raise </TD><TD>$ 158.00 </TD><TD>00:04:40 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>All-in </TD><TD>$ 141.00 </TD><TD>00:04:43 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>All-in </TD><TD>$ 587.00 </TD><TD>00:04:47 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Call </TD><TD>$ 459.00 </TD><TD>00:04:49 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Betting round completed </TD><TD>Last active pot = $0.00
Side pot 5 = $551.00
Side pot 1 = $892.00 </TD><TD>00:04:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Card dealt to table </TD><TD>9 2 4 </TD><TD>00:04:51 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Betting round completed </TD><TD>Last active pot = $0.00
Side pot 5 = $551.00
Side pot 1 = $892.00 </TD><TD>00:04:53 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Card dealt to table </TD><TD>7 </TD><TD>00:04:53 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Betting round completed </TD><TD>Last active pot = $0.00
Side pot 5 = $551.00
Side pot 1 = $892.00 </TD><TD>00:04:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Card dealt to table </TD><TD>8 </TD><TD>00:04:55 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Rake amount </TD><TD>$ 3.00 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD></TD><TD>Betting round completed </TD><TD>Last active pot = $-0.01
Side pot 5 = $549.86
Side pot 1 = $890.15 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Showdown </TD><TD>Show card: Straight
J 10 9 8 7 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>EddieOB </TD><TD>Showdown </TD><TD>Show card: Pair
A A 9 8 7 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>zaatar </TD><TD>Showdown </TD><TD>Show card: Pair
A A 9 8 7 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR><TR class=results><TD>TheSeraph </TD><TD>Hand result </TD><TD>$ 1,440.01 </TD><TD>00:04:57 </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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Posts: 1,635
Joined: May 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:53pm) in reply to Zefa
I knew posting this you would think your analysis was right zefa....I agree with the other players though and thats why i made the move i did. If i play a smaller pot and see I flop a straight draw and am 40% to win against the hands face up so then what do i do? Don't let the fact i lost make you think you are correct. Thats about as bad they can show up there.
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Posts: 2,442
Joined: Mar 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:56pm) in reply to EddieO
As played, just shove it. I might not play weak aces like this as strongly as you did, but once all that money is in there and you have 38 in the pot already, just repot and see what Seraph does. Hopefully, he comes up with ds kings or some connected cards (unsuited).
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Posts: 2,442
Joined: Mar 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 12:58pm) in reply to EddieO
Pretty much standard, Seraph stacks off with a ds connector and hits. He's not going to get away with that for long because putting in 300+ BBs preflop with that hand is pure spew. You got in HU against him as a fave (5-8%), which is money in your pocket in the long run. Don't listen to Zefa.
Edit: You are a dog in this situation to Seraph's hand... so I was wrong:
<pre>pokenum -mc 500000 -o ad as 3h 5h - jc th 7h 9c / ac qc ah qh
Omaha Hi: 500000 sampled boards
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
As Ad 5h 3h 221298 44.26 278702 55.74 0 0.00 0.443
Jc 9c Th 7h 278702 55.74 221298 44.26 0 0.00 0.557
However, this is a WORST CASE scenario. If Seraph turns up anything other than AAQQds, you
will be in better shape. Seraph may have played this hand because he thought he was against
two pairs of aces, but shoving half a buy-in off of a raise does not necessarily mean AAxx.
I still advise a shove here, you're a fave against a large portion of Seraph's range.
</pre> -
Posts: 665
Joined: Jun 06Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 1:01pm) in reply to EddieO
If you're play Ad As 3h 5h or the sake of flopping a straight draw or a nut low flush draw... you're playing bad omaha.
Flat calling the 38$ raise was awful and if you and the other posters really think it was a good play, then more power to you and GL, hope to see you at my tables.
I'm not correct because you lost. If you won this pot, I'm still correct. The only way you'll convince me otherwise is if you had some read or info about the players that you did not include in your original post. -
Posts: 901
Joined: Jul 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 1:12pm) in reply to DexterCain
i call with weak AA in PLO not to trap but more to conceal the strength of my hand...i would fold this against 3 opponents AIPF
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Posts: 901
Joined: Jul 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 1:14pm) in reply to TheOmaholic
wow i didnt notice that, i change my opinion, you should have re pot the original pot...ISO FTW
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Posts: 4,965
Joined: Feb 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 1:52pm) in reply to Zefa
I didn't really see anyone saying flat calling was the proper move. I believe the majority of us stated to get em in preflop with another re-pot bet.
Like I stated earlier, I hardly play PLO, and when I do play Omaha it's usually hi/lo.
It seemed pretty standard from the beginning to re-pot there b/c you will get alot of hands to fold here. The only hands that will not fold might be top drawing hands, and even still it's hard for someone to gamble away 90% of their chips with a non-made hand.
again, just my logic...take it for what's worth -
Posts: 63
Joined: Oct 07Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 8:34pm) in reply to EddieO
agreed w Stupor and others in thread, I think i would need a sick
read to avoid going broke. Note that it is really ul that SS had your aces. -
TheOmaholic
Do NOT Trust - Scammer
Posts: 1,957
Joined: Aug 05Nov 7th, 2007 (11/7/2007 9:16pm) in reply to vanbasten9
Regardless of what zefa says, the best play preflop is still making it about $100 to go after the other guy repots to 38, that way if seraph calls the $100, the other guy moves in for $183, and you repot isolate him to $650 or whatever.
Folding extremely weak AA hands preflop in omaha is sometimes a good play. This is not one of those times. Unless you feel the need to be 100% results oriented, you should be able to understand why getting in preflop here with your hand is necessary. -
TheOmaholic
Do NOT Trust - Scammer
Posts: 1,957
Joined: Aug 05Nov 8th, 2007 (11/8/2007 8:42am) in reply to King Acehole
Folding hands like A A 9 6 rainbow is obviously a must when there's a large multiway pot developing, and it becomes clear preflop that 2 or 3 other players are going to be committed to the hand. You obviously can't expect to run stacks with naked aces vs. 3 random omaha hands and come out the winner.
As far as opponents that repot preflop ONLY with AA, I see less and less of those at the levels that I play, b/c as the stakes increase, the players get much trickier, especially shorthanded. However, I obviously realize that at 9 handed 1-2 and 2-4 PLO tables, there are many tightish players who only repot w/ AA, and yes, sometimes you may be able to get away from AA hands preflop in 3-way pots.
However, the situation here is not one of those situations, as there was a significantly large HU sidepot to vie for.
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