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AA hand from late in PS 360 pp $9.90

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  1. sunishnyc sunishnyc is offline

    Manalapan, NJ
    United States

    Posts: 10
    Joined: Jun 07

    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:01pm)

    been at the table a while and made a nice comeback after being down low early...about 77 left (36 paid) and in good shape chipwise...villan has been calling pre a lot and seems loose and has almost the same stack...

    please let me know what you put villan on...is my betting pattern okay? bet more or push turn?

    By the river I had less than a pot size bet left...check calling, check folding, raise folding all seemed pretty ugly

    pokerstars Game #10309813389: Tournament #51837869, $9.00+$0.90 Hold'em
    No Limit - Level VII (100/200) - 2007/06/06 - 23:02:41 (ET)
    Table '51837869 38' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
    Seat 1: SB (10220 in chips)
    Seat 2: BB (8790 in chips)
    Seat 3: --- (3433 in chips)
    Seat 4: --- (3215 in chips)
    Seat 5: --- (9015 in chips)
    Seat 6: --- (19288 in chips)
    Seat 7: hero (7695 in chips)
    Seat 8: villan (7310 in chips)
    Seat 9: --- (12709 in chips)
    All players post the ante 25

    SB: posts small blind 100
    BB: posts big blind 200
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Hero [Ah As]
    4 folds
    hero: raises 400 to 600
    villan: calls 600
    3 folds

    POT: (1,300)
    *** FLOP *** [Js 5s Td]
    Hero: bets 1000
    Villan: calls 1000

    POT: (3,300)
    *** TURN *** [Js 5s Td] [2d]
    Hero: bets 2000
    Villan: calls 2000

    POT: (5,300)
    *** RIVER *** [Js 5s Td 2d] [Ts]

    Hero: $4070 left and covers villan and he????
     
  2. Phi Phi is offline aka tennisee

    Posts: 16,250
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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:05pm) in reply to sunishnyc

    IMO the best play here would be to check call. This gives him the opportunity to bluff at the river at which you pick him off, or if he does have the best hand, check calling reduces your losses if you were to bet out and get reraised.
  3. sunishnyc sunishnyc is offline

    Manalapan, NJ
    United States

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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:11pm) in reply to Phi

    ty...only issue is that if I plan to check call a shove or any bet for that matter aren't I better off shoving? What bet will he make that I can call without being crippled?
     
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  4. Phi Phi is offline aka tennisee

    Posts: 16,250
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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:13pm) in reply to sunishnyc

    You aren't better off shoving because by checking the river you are giving him the ability to make a bluff at the river and gaining more chips than if you shoved and he mucked.

    EDIT: And if you shove and you are beat you are busto whereas if you let him bet he might bet less than your stack and you would still have chips left.
  5. sunishnyc sunishnyc is offline

    Manalapan, NJ
    United States

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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:40pm) in reply to Phi

    Phi...so assuming I check what size bet can I call...if he shoves do I call to try to pick off the bluff? If he bets most of my stack the same...just trying to get a feel or plan as this has comes up a few times now and want to be ready for the next one...thanks again
     
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  6. MaitreD MaitreD is offline

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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 1:46pm) in reply to sunishnyc

    Phi is correct IMO. You limit your losses by check calling any amount. And if you were debating shoving anyway, I don't think it is correct to make this laydown. Villain has not shown strength at any time, simply smooth calling. He may think he is trapping you by playing with KK-QQ. The more likely holding IMO is A10, K-10 or Q-10. That would explain why he wasn't ready to throw it away after the flop. I think it unlikely he would play a set this passively with such a draw heavy board (especially after the turn). I would say that you have to call this, but you are going to get shown trips.
    Your mistake was not shoving on the turn. You are betting about 2/3 of the pot on the turn, an amount unlikely to scare off someone so committed already (and loose as you noted earlier). The correct play was to shove before the river. Once that mistake is made, I believe you have to call with Aces Up, even though you will lose to trips.
  7. sunishnyc sunishnyc is offline

    Manalapan, NJ
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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 2:03pm) in reply to MaitreD

    ty...you nailed it...villan had A 10 which surprised me...I know it is online and loose but to call that much on two streets with 2nd pair was hard for me to see...I guess shoving the turn would have been okay but at that point I think villan would have folded (such a massive overbet) and I lose the value of someone calling a big bet with 2 outs...
     
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  8. Phi Phi is offline aka tennisee

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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 2:10pm) in reply to sunishnyc

    I dont think shoving the turn is a bad play at all. The flat call on a such a draw heavy flop should concern you. At the stage of the tournament you were in I think it would be a much better play to protect what you can pretty much assume is the best hand at the time since a decent bet pretty much commits on the river.
  9. Sane Man Sane Man is offline

    Orwigsburg, PA
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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 2:19pm) in reply to MaitreD

    Couple problems with check/calling in this spot.

    1) Losing value on someone calling down with AJ, KJ, QJ, any J.

    2) Opens you up to be bluffed if you aren't set on calling.

    Check/calling is really only the best option if you think he has something like KQ and he thinks he has to bluff to win. Any other hand that beats you got there, and I don't think he's going to try betting a jack.

    A blocking bet won't work because you don't have enough behind to protect. Even if you try like a 1/4ish bet of 2k on the end, that only leaves 2k behind.

    I think I lead this river for the rest of my stack because I'm not going to want to continue with <10BB and I want to maximize value on someone crying calling down with a jack. Either that or I'm evaluating the hand and deciding I'm beat and check/folding. I don't think I'm doing anything in between.

    Edit: Just saw the result. I don't think my opinion of this hand changes however.
  10. sunishnyc sunishnyc is offline

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    Jun 7th, 2007 (6/7/2007 2:47pm) in reply to Sane Man

    the dilemma of pushing the turn is the standard do I protect or try to maximize value...don't think there is a right answer but when all is said and done the last hand I saw him on was a pair of 10s drawing to 2 outs...basic Sklansky stuff says if cards are face up and we force them to make the incorrect play then we benefit...I doubt they call a turn shove so that would forfeit too many valuable chips...just bad river mojo
     
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