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AKo in $10 deep stack vs fishy player

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  1. pupkevicius pupkevicius is offline

    Dartford
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 34
    Joined: May 08

    Nov 9th, 2011 (11/9/2011 8:53pm)

    Ok so i pick up AKo in sb and a player which I think is generally fishy gets involved,

    My thinking pre is that I need to reraise an amount preflop where i can correctly shove any non A or K flop because the pot size (on the flop) makes it correct to do so.

    What you guys think of my flop shove?

    pokerstars Game #70288829037: Tournament #546010383, $10+$1 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2011/11/09 15:37:39 ET
    Table '546010383 56' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
    Seat 1: SneakerPro (18935 in chips)
    Seat 2: giumis (26087 in chips)
    Seat 3: vetaly25 (7335 in chips)
    Seat 4: pupkevicius1 (10731 in chips)
    Seat 5: RBNAS (6192 in chips)
    Seat 6: Cbank32 (3645 in chips)
    Seat 7: GorillaOwner (10230 in chips)
    Seat 8: Erik Fyn 08 (11600 in chips)
    Seat 9: Tomano777 (15850 in chips)
    pupkevicius1: posts small blind 100
    RBNAS: posts big blind 200
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to pupkevicius1 [Kc As]
    Cbank32: folds
    GorillaOwner: folds
    Erik Fyn 08: folds
    Tomano777: calls 200
    SneakerPro: folds
    giumis: raises 800 to 1000
    vetaly25: folds
    pupkevicius1: raises 3000 to 4000
    RBNAS: folds
    Tomano777: folds
    giumis: calls 3000
    *** FLOP *** [4c 5s 2s]
    pupkevicius1: bets 6731 and is all-in
    giumis: calls 6731
    *** TURN *** [4c 5s 2s] [Kh]
    *** RIVER *** [4c 5s 2s Kh] [Qh]
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    pupkevicius1: shows [Kc As] (a pair of Kings)
    giumis: shows [6h 5h] (a pair of Fives)
    pupkevicius1 collected 21862 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 21862 | Rake 0
    Board [4c 5s 2s Kh Qh]
    Seat 1: SneakerPro folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 2: giumis showed [6h 5h] and lost with a pair of Fives
    Seat 3: vetaly25 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 4: pupkevicius1 (small blind) showed [Kc As] and won (21862) with a pair of Kings
    Seat 5: RBNAS (big blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 6: Cbank32 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 7: GorillaOwner folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 8: Erik Fyn 08 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 9: Tomano777 folded before Flop
  2. mdshack14 mdshack14 is offline

    Auburn Hills, MI
    United States

    Posts: 5,646
    Joined: May 07

    Nov 9th, 2011 (11/9/2011 9:38pm) in reply to pupkevicius

    You had a plan going into the hand and stuck to it. I like the play all around.
     
  3. PeaceGotAces PeaceGotAces is offline

    Halifax
    Canada

    Posts: 274
    Joined: Feb 10

    Nov 10th, 2011 (11/10/2011 2:12am) in reply to mdshack14

    The 4x 3b isn't great. You can make it smaller and leave your self with a PS bet..you make it 4k and you have like 6.5k left in a pot that's 8500. If you make it 3k you'll have almost exactly a PS bet..flop shove is pretty mandatory if you play it like this which i think is the best play
  4. edwardt1988 edwardt1988 is offline

    Posts: 2,009
    Joined: Mar 11

    Nov 10th, 2011 (11/10/2011 3:17am) in reply to PeaceGotAces

     
    Originally Posted by PeaceGotAces View Post

    The 4x 3b isn't great. You can make it smaller and leave your self with a PS bet..you make it 4k and you have like 6.5k left in a pot that's 8500. If you make it 3k you'll have almost exactly a PS bet..flop shove is pretty mandatory if you play it like this which i think is the best play

    Don't agree. He maximized the value pre. If the guy is willing to call an extra 3k, why not make it that much? Like OP said, Villain is fishy, so it's not like the bet sizing is gonna skew his range towards the top and fold out the weaker hands. Villain is willing to call with almost his entire raising range there. On the flop, I like having less than a pot sized bet left. Why? Well villain seems to have alot of difficulty finding a fold button, so I'm thinking a pot sized bet might be more likely to get him to fold air or even a weak pair. When OP bets less than a pot sized bet on the flop, villain probably thinks he's "priced in" with almost all of his calling range, including complete air or a weak pair, like in the example.

    OP played this well. The plan was never to get a fold from villain, but to get it in and have villain call with a wide range, and I think he executed it well
  5. PeaceGotAces PeaceGotAces is offline

    Halifax
    Canada

    Posts: 274
    Joined: Feb 10

    Nov 10th, 2011 (11/10/2011 12:03pm) in reply to edwardt1988

    i don't think hero is shoving hoping to get called by worse off the flop. I find it really hard to believe the hero is shoving that flop hoping to get called by worse.He's shoving hoping not to get called which isn't going to happen much when the villain is getting like 2.25-1. If you make it a standard sizing at least you'll have fold equity when you miss.

    huge fishes are going to fold 56 way more often than not to the 4x 3b..this just happened to work out. Sure you maximized value pre but you didn't exactly set up the flop good.
  6. Matty_B Matty_B is offline

    Edinburgh
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 98
    Joined: Jul 10

    Nov 10th, 2011 (11/10/2011 12:18pm) in reply to PeaceGotAces

     
    Originally Posted by PeaceGotAces View Post

    i don't think hero is shoving hoping to get called by worse off the flop. I find it really hard to believe the hero is shoving that flop hoping to get called by worse.He's shoving hoping not to get called which isn't going to happen much when the villain is getting like 2.25-1. If you make it a standard sizing at least you'll have fold equity when you miss.

    huge fishes are going to fold 56 way more often than not to the 4x 3b..this just happened to work out. Sure you maximized value pre but you didn't exactly set up the flop good.

    Ok so say we set the flop up with a pot sized be behind, then what? check fold? Don't really like that as an idea. Bet/Fold? Not an option. Also this is over a 5x so the sizing had to be pretty big. We were probably expecting to get it in pre flop and when we don't, we are only left with one option which we would use with 100% of our hands in this situation.
  7. PeaceGotAces PeaceGotAces is offline

    Halifax
    Canada

    Posts: 274
    Joined: Feb 10

    Nov 11th, 2011 (11/11/2011 1:59am) in reply to Matty_B

    What do we do if we have a pot sized bet left? Shove, that's the plan...you aren't 3betting to check fold or bet fold.
    My problem with the 3b sizing is that you're folding out pretty much everything except good hands (When someone 3bets almost half their 50bb stack it's obvious they aren't folding) and you have no fold equity if he does flat. If you make it smaller you give him a chance to make a mistake.

    So you're not getting 4bet light he's usually never flatting...he's either going to have you crushed or fold most of the time. Make it around 3k...more chance for him to spaz and flat. Then shove the flop if he flats (you will actually have FE). I think if you're going to 4x you're better off shoving pre.
    Obviously this worked out but the average fish is not calling off 20bb with 56.
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