In my previous post about the petition to change payout structures, I may have offended some people who work under pokerstars management - this was not at all my intention. My intention was to bring up a subject that I believe is of great concern to a majority of mtt regulars in hopes of a change in the future. I know the management at Pokerstars puts in many hours to satisfy its wealth of customers to which we are all very appreciative. All i ask is that the issue regarding payouts be heard and considered - nothing further. Thanks for your continued service as the benchmark site in online poker.

-Joe

 

Originally Posted by jfiiue4

They must of turned the doom switch on full throttle

lol

Hello Dustin,
I regret to hear that you don't like our tournament payouts. We'll have to
agree to disagree though, as we've set them up in a way that we think is
overall best for all parties. With that said, we are constantly tweaking
them to make what we consider to be improvements.

The percentage paid to first place varies widely depending upon the
particular tournament and the total number of players in the tournament.
For example, most tournaments with 20 players would pay 50% to first place,
while a tournament with 200 entrants would pay first place about 20%. A
tournament with thousands of entrants is going to pay less to first place in
terms of the percentage of the prize pool, but of course the more people
there are in a tournament, the bigger first place is going to be in terms of
dollars won.

Regarding the percentage of the field paid, your opinion is noted. Again
though, we just don't agree. There absolutely is a place for 10% payouts,
and in many of our tournaments we do pay about 10-12% of the field. In
others we pay 20% of more, and at the other end of the spectrum we have
winner-take-all tournaments. In general though, we feel that paying about
15% of the field is the best compromise between the desires of a <SPAN class=yshortcuts id=lw_1221086886_0>great many
people</SPAN>, all of whom have different opinions on this subject.

15% payouts are not new to <SPAN class=yshortcuts id=lw_1221086886_1>pokerstars</SPAN>. They've been the standard for a
great many of our tournaments for nearly two years. The only significant
recent change is to actually *increase* the amount of money paid to the
final and penultimate tables, which many of the forum posters list as one of
their main issues with PokerStars payouts. You might be interested in a
recent forum post by my colleague on this subject, Bryan S., which you can
read at this URL:

<SPAN class=yshortcuts id=lw_1221086886_2>http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/61/mtt-community/stars-seriously-needs-some-changes-295501/page4.html</SPAN>

We do listen and respond to customer feedback. We monitor emails on this
subject and read the forums, and while the people calling for change are a
tiny fraction of our tourney customer base, we still wanted to address their
concerns by providing more tournaments with steeper payouts. With the
recent expansion of our guarantee tournament schedule, we also changed the
payouts on many of the higher buy-in tournaments to pay closer to 10%,
rather than the 15% payouts they were previously using. Examples include
but are not limited to the Sunday $215+R, the Wednesday Quarter Million, the
Nightly Hundred Grand, the $50,000 guarantee at 23:00, and the $109+R $70k
guarantee at 14:00. I hope these examples will help you to find a
tournament on PokerStars that suits you.

Regards,
Mike Jones
PokerStars Poker Room Management

don't be surprised if you don't start cashing on their site hoodini.

i said its to late to apologize!!!!!!!!!!!............... its toooooooooooooo late!!!!!!

THIS

"I won the non guaranteed $20 MTT last night (small brag) that had 207 ppl in it for only $880. The winner of a $20 180 man sng get $1080.... thats just wrong." - SirSwish6

Here is the secret... stop playing on pokerstars... THEN email them and complain about how much equity you have lost due to the 20% payout structure

 

Originally Posted by pzane

THIS

"I won the non guaranteed $20 MTT last night (small brag) that had 207 ppl in it for only $880. The winner of a $20 180 man sng get $1080.... thats just wrong."

hey thats my post

 

Originally Posted by jesterwords

Wow,

That sure is helpful to the small stakes grinders who have to deal with 20% prize pool payouts.

I doubt I will ever play the 3r again after this...
<TABLE id=ctl00_ctl00_bcr_bcr_scoresTable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR class=P5_ListRow><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>pokerstars</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>$3.30+R NL Hold'em [$40, 000 guaranteed]</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>08/17/2008 17:00:00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 42,882.00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 3</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">16</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 107.21</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell P5_SlidingScore">39.23</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
8 hours of my life... beat roughly 4K people and out of a 42K prize pool, and I got $107 bucks... that is a waste of time. It is an insult. It made me seriously reconsider why I bother to even play at PokerStars.

Lets look at another example of how the low/mid stakes players get robbed.

<TABLE id=ctl00_ctl00_bcr_bcr_scoresTable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR class=P5_ListRow><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>PokerStars</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>$8.80+R NLHE [$20, 000 guaranteed!]</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>12/16/2007 09:00:00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 35,872.00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 9</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">3</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 2,690.41</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Took 3rd in a ~36K prize pool for roughly 2.7K or 7.5% of the prize pool.

Now, lets compare that with a score from FTP (also FTP had more than half the people playing than the PokerStars tourney).

<TABLE id=ctl00_ctl00_bcr_bcr_scoresTable cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=1><TBODY><TR class=P5_ListRowAlt><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>FullTiltPoker</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>$12,000 Guarantee (Rebuy)</TD><TD class=P5_ScoresCell>09/01/2008 14:31:00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 21,420.00</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 20</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">3</TD><TD class="P5_ScoresCell P5_NumberCell">$ 2,463.30</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
So, FTP has 21K in the prize pool and I win ~2.5K or 11.5% of the prize pool.

Overall difference is $227.11 and the difference in prize pools = $14,452

Which site would you play?

^THIS ...

keeps me from playing there at all now. i wish another legitimate site would open up, b/c between payouts, structure, and low-mid stakes mtt options, full tilt crushes stars right now, and its not even close.

as someone who gets to play once or twice a week, there is no point in me even playing on stars anymore . . . so i don't. =P

Wein pretty much sums it up.

Since most of the tourneys that I would play are 20% payout tournaments. I choose not to play them.

There is still plenty of value to playing other games, if that is your choice.

Don't like the 20% payouts, then simply do not play them, and either play something else, or don't play.

It is pretty simple.