there have been a lot of articles/discussions about bankroll management with regards to x amt of buyins relative to total bankroll and many people feel standards are laid out with cash games, mtt's and sit & go's. but i feel what hasn't been discussed is what exactly constitutes "bankroll". i.e. how much of your actual net worth do you devote to poker, whether it be online roll/live poker.. roll or both. for people with full time jobs outside of poker, how much of your earnings/savings is dedicated to poker. for full time online pros, when you make big scores, how much of it do you move away from poker (investing in other "safer" investment options outside of poker) and how much would you roll back to allow for greater volume and/or higher buy in's for tourney or cash games. is there a particular percentage you'd cash out? when is it justified to go outside your "poker roll", for shots & bigger buy in live tourneys & bigger cash games? knowing that your overall real life bankroll (w/ or without including assets such as house & car.. etc.), but maybe not your poker roll. curious to hear how different poker folk approach this. thx. -g

A reasonable strategy for a "pro" is to pay himself an hourly rate based on what his edge in a given game is, and only pay himself once expenses have been paid and the bankroll needed to handle swings is kept intact. For instance, say you were a $10/$20 Limit player and made about 1 BB/hour on average (with a large standard deviation, mind you); this means that if you were playing with a sufficient bankroll such that your risk of ruin were close to 0, you would make about $20/hr. However, to stay in action, you need to maintain a roll of, say, 500 BB's (maybe more, depending on your adevantage and standard deviation) to prevent risk of ruin--plus, you may want to continue growing the roll so you can play $15/$30 and make a better hourly rate. This means that you have to set aside some of your hourly rate for bankroll growth and maintenance. Then, you should make sure you are making enough to pay all your bills playing Poker. So let's say you take $10/hour to pay your bills, and another $5/hour for bankroll growth and maintenance. So for actual disposable "spending" money, you might only be paying yourself $5/hour, and that will only be during the upswings, because during downswings you will want to be diverting funds to save your roll.

This is a drastically oversimplified model, of course, but it does highlight some of the concerns you will face as a "pro."

pass,

you asked what I think are very good questions and made some points at the same time.

When most people ask questions about bankroll management "BM" it usually starts and ends with how many buy ins, big bets, etc. do I need to play at a given level? When can I move up levels and when do I need to move down?

IMO - that stuff is just a spec of info and is really a model based upon averages much as a black jack player would use.

To me, and I know I'm a bit of a nut when it comes to the subject, BM is more akin to a business plan. It takes time to construct and time to work on.

The basics of the plan need to be built from hard info that only the player themselves has complete knowledge of. In a sense, BM is a discipline skill. The more you work on it the better and more proficient you become. Think of it as Ninja BM to be cute.

Each person has different means. Some have a tough budget to work with and others have no money worries at all. Some can only scrape up $100 to deposit online and others can afford $10K or more right from the get go.

The size of a bankroll each person requires can vary at the same limit or level of play. Since each person has different comfort levels some can play well with less security than others can.

Knowing yourself should be a part of your planning.

This would all be based upon your play over time which you should be keeping very accurate records of. Live play, online play, etc. and finding your best results on average.

Investing, living expenses, car payments, growing your bankroll and your game can all be a part of a BM financial plan.

This is something I wrote for another P5er some time as far as some basic planning structure.

sounds like you have some poker talent. Bankroll Management ...errrrrrrrrr nothing that you can't work on.

does sound like you are a winning player which is great.. Still need some specifics if you want to do projections which is criticle for good BM. Goals are great but they should be based upon solid data.

one thing I'm not a fan of is incurring a loss of $5K to a $40K bankroll in one day. Thats a little bit much and in the long run could be a problem. 3-5% is about the maximum loss you can really handle in a day of your total bankroll so it doesn't suffer to big a hit but everyone has their own sense of comfort. Also,h aving a $9K day is fantastic but lets not think about that now. It's more about what are your hourly averages and how do they break down per table. You will need to know this and really should be aware of it.

Example.

Lets say you play 6 hours a day 5 days a week. 3 tables at a time. 45 weeks a year. You like your vacation time too ;-)

say you are playing 2/4 NL tabels and have and expected hourly return based upon your averages of $43 per hour per table.

$43 x 3 = $129 per hour
x6 hours = $774 per day
x5 days = $3,870 per week
x45 weeks= $174,150 per year profit Ding Ding Ding!
** make adjustments accordingly of course

** now , I'm saying this in an effort to be helpful and not to be a smartass or know it all. If you aren't very aware of managing your bankroll on a daily basis as well as making adjustments then you could have a problem. Don't want to see that happen but if your numbers aren't broken down so you know your hourly expectation per table and to how you perform best in the number of tables you play there could be some issues. Adjustments are a key.

Your bankroll is a weapon or at least a very important part of your arsenal.