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EbanyVRot is new to the table so ive seen very little of his play. I think maybe I played this hand badly but not sure what I should have done. Interested to see what people think?
#Game No : 5420916277
***** Hand History for Game 5420916277 *****
$50 NL Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, November 07, 04:28:12 ET 2006
Table Table 127916 (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 2: Tinkster21 ( $170.90 )
Seat 4: ZoroAstra ( $68.40 )
Seat 6: BDB0815 ( $38.35 )
Seat 9: DetroitVelvetSmooth ( $58.57 )
Seat 3: barthozz ( $45.50 )
Seat 7: EbanyVRot ( $42 )
Seat 1: Danielo114 ( $50.35 )
Seat 10: PuuCee ( $49 )
Seat 8: korrral ( $24.25 )
PuuCee posts small blind [$0.25].
Danielo114 posts big blind [$0.50].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to ZoroAstra [ 5
4
]
Tinkster21 calls [$0.50].
barthozz folds.
ZoroAstra calls [$0.50].
BDB0815 folds.
EbanyVRot calls [$0.50].
korrral folds.
DetroitVelvetSmooth folds.
npeBeg has joined the table.
PuuCee calls [$0.25].
Danielo114 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 4
, 7
, 6
]
PuuCee checks.
Danielo114 checks.
Tinkster21 bets [$3].
ZoroAstra calls [$3].
EbanyVRot raises [$10].
PuuCee folds.
Danielo114 folds.
Tinkster21 folds.
ZoroAstra calls [$7].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 9
]
ZoroAstra checks.
EbanyVRot is all-In [$31.50]
ZoroAstra folds.
EbanyVRot does not show cards.
EbanyVRot wins $55.75
Game #5420917319 starts. -
I'm no cash game expert but I would push this hand harder on the flop . I would have raised the original $3 to try and take it there but when I was reraised I would have pushed on him. If you are playing within your BR this to me is an easy push. Instead by calling if you dont hit your draws on the turn you are going to be facing a BIG bet which is exactly what happened and he priced you out.
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I'd be interested to know what hand you put him on.
There's $55.75 in the Pot and it'd cost you $31.50 to Call, so you're getting 1.77:1 Pot Odds.
Your equity is 63% vs a Random hand. It's still 42% vs 99 or better. You're only in real trouble if he specifically has either 8 5 or 10 8.
So, if he has a random hand your average return would be 63% of 87.25 or $54.97.
If he has 99 or an overpair to the Board your return would be 42% of 87.25 or $35.65.
It's only costing you $31.50 to Call, so in both cases you show a long term profit by Calling..
The only way a Call becomes the wrong thing to do is if he specifically has 8, 5 or 10, 8. -
Yeah uh exactly what he said ^^^^^... <---- no math major :)
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pokenum -h 4c 5c - 9d 9s -- 4s 7c 6c 9h
Holdem Hi: 44 enumerated boards containing 4s 7c 6c 9h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
5c 4c 14 31.82 30 68.18 0 0.00 0.318
9s 9d 30 68.18 14 31.82 0 0.00 0.682
Not quite 42% but you are still getting almost the right pot odds to call here. And 99 is probably the worst case scenario.
pokenum -h 4c 5c - td ts -- 4s 7c 6c 9h
Holdem Hi: 44 enumerated boards containing 4s 7c 6c 9h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
5c 4c 17 38.64 27 61.36 0 0.00 0.386
Ts Td 27 61.36 17 38.64 0 0.00 0.614
pokenum -h 4c 5c - kd kh -- 4s 7c 6c 9h
Holdem Hi: 44 enumerated boards containing 4s 7c 6c 9h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
5c 4c 20 45.45 24 54.55 0 0.00 0.455
Kd Kh 24 54.55 20 45.45 0 0.00 0.545
I think here the best bet is to push the flop after the original raise to 10$. You're going to be flippin a coin if you get called but you do have some fold equity and there's dead money out there that's giving you good odds to race against an over pair or TPTK. -
Correct.
If he has 99, equity is 0.318.
42% is for the whole range of PP from 99 to AA. -
for me you played this hand too weak on the flop...
You are a favorite over most hands on the flop... you are beating 2 pair, any over pair.
In the worst case sanario (if he has 77 or even a made straight) you are near a coin flip (given that if he has a made straight he is a 54% favorite to win the hand (not including split)... as a split is not bad for you you have about a 45% of getting out with all your money back).
Statisticaly the chances of him having one of those two hands is slim... so chances are he has 2 pair... which you are favorite against... or even just top pair as he may feel that he is ahead as neither of you look too strong (on flop)...
I would have raised Thinkster and hard... then if Ebany reraised me... (which i dont think he would do even if he had 2pr as a big bet makes it looks like you have a made straight and are betting hard to get out any flush chasers and deff not if he had say A7 which he would have to fold)... i would have reraised him and put all my money in the middle (he can literaly only call you with made straight or tripps and even then you are not in bad shape).
I dont like to get my money in with draws except open ended straight flush ones as you are a favorite to so many hands (unless the board is paired like if you have Q
K
and board comes 10
J
J
... in this case i play it real slow or get out once ive evaluated my player).
Good Luck in future
Comments on advice...? -
As you can tell to put this guy on a pocket pair is hard considering there was no raise preflop.
I put him on 6,7.
I don't think pushing the flop would be a terrible Idea, I just don't thing you can put him on 99's or 10's since he is middle, late postion and did not raise.
Same thing happened to me today and I was the in same spot with 2,3s and called a small raise in postion. flopped bottom pair w/ flush draw. The original better bet $3 buck and the other called and I bumped it $9. Original better folded and the other guy flat called, I turn my flush and he check to me and I put him all in and he called me with A's. The river was a 3 and I took down the pot.
Now if you ask me it was the worst I have ever seen someone play A's.
The point is that he could have had a big hand or air being in that position to raise or on a better flush draw then u. You just dont' know since there was know raise.
I would sugest raise preflop if you want to play that hand or folding.
GL
MRK -
Agreed. Situations like this probably are examples of why having a sufficient bankroll is a good thing.
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If Villain has 8 5 and the Board is 4, 6, 7 his equity is 0.59 and yours is 0.41
0.41 * 87.25 = 33.70. So, a Push at that point ( on the Flop ) looks good on the surface. But, with Villain's already made Straight, after the Turn misses you, you drop to an equity of 22.3%.
The Push on the Flop looks mighty iffy then. -
Assuming you're properly bankrolled, you should never hesitate to get all of your money in as a favorite in a cash game. In this case, on the flop, you are almost assuredly a favorite. Either you've got the monster draw with 15 outs, and likely 18, unless he's got the straight or set already. Or he's raising with suited overcards, in which case you're slightly ahead with your made hand.
Either way, you need to be raising pre-flop, and raising hard. -
I woulda pushed hard on the flop. The reason is that there's really only two hands you are afraid of, and that is a higher flush draw or a higher str8 draw.
You are a favorite or slight underdog against a made hand, yet an underdog against a draw.
So push the flop. Drawing hands will fold to you (which is good) and if you get called, it will be vs a made hand and you are at worse a slight dog (which is good).
One more thing, and I'm not trying to be mean. You shouldn't be calling w/small suited connectors if you are afraid to play them aggressively post flop. -
Thanks for the responses guys, very helpful indeed. I agree that I should have pushed this hand harder on the flop. When Ebany re-raised with a raise and a call in front, I was immediately thinking set. I hoped to make a hand on the turn and then play back at him. In hindsight, a set was maybe unlikely anyway given the preflop action. In the end, being too weak/passive allowed him to take the hand away from me. As people have said, on the flop there were good odds vs most of his possible hands and when you add in fold equity a push would have been a good play. I guess with low suited connectors you couldnt hope for a better flop so best to push it hard or dont bother playing them.
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Another and important reason to push the flop is because of the odds if you miss on the turn.
Your odds are effectively cut in half if you wiff and with one card to go and bad odds he can easily push you off the hand. You have to get the most money in while there are still 2 cards to come and you are still the favourite.
It's exactly why people like to push with AK; if you wiff the flop with AK, you're only 25% to win against a pair instead of the usual pre-flop coin flip. -
I think the point we're all trying to make here is that you need a better basic understanding of the Odds.
Taking an example from above: Villain has 7 6. Suited or offsuit makes no difference.
With a Pair + the OESF Draw, you are a 55% favorite on the Flop even though Villain has Top Two.
Whether you ultimately win or lose this hand, you cannot pass up opportunities like this. You're the favorite and you're getting 1.77:1 Pot Odds. Poker doesn't get any better than that. -
^^^ agree with everyone. reraise (preferably all-in) on the flop when you have massive equity in the pot. making him lay his hand down isn't a terrible possibility either.
god bless huge draws
god bless fold equity
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