You have to be able to have a good idea of your odds of winnning, the pot odds, and understand implied odds. Pot odds are really easy, ex. if there is 4500 in the pot and you have to call a 900 bet your gettting 5-1 (amount in pot):(what you have to call), pretty easy.

The part I struggle with is when I try to use pot odds to make it unfavorable for someone to call. I'll give you an example:

Let's say I have top pair with the river card to come and I think my opponent has 4 cards to a flush. I want to raise him enough to make him go away, but not cripple myself if he calls and hits. I play mostly $5 18 sngs.

i may get flamed here..but here goes; pot odds is overrated! Do not believe in it, and dont let it be part of your game. Instead 'implied odds' is what the bread and butter is. Ex. if you have small PP and have to call say 4xBB raise with 3 callers already, your implied odds is heavily in your favour to make your call to hit your set. IMO 'pot odds' should never really figure in say paying off a river bet with middle pair or w/e. If you have determined 'you just want see' so you call, then thats fine, but like we say, if you have a good idea your beat, then chances are, that you are in fact beat..dont let 'pot odds' decide that for you!
So also keep in mind: if you think your opponent is drawing 4 to a flush..play defense...jam it, so theres no decision to make if in fact he hits, and you now have to pay off a silly river bet again.

 

Originally Posted by racer

i may get flamed here..but here goes; pot odds is overrated! Do not believe in it, and dont let it be part of your game. Instead 'implied odds' is what the bread and butter is. Ex. if you have small PP and have to call say 4xBB raise with 3 callers already, your implied odds is heavily in your favour to make your call to hit your set. IMO 'pot odds' should never really figure in say paying off a river bet with middle pair or w/e. If you have determined 'you just want see' so you call, then thats fine, but like we say, if you have a good idea your beat, then chances are, that you are in fact beat..dont let 'pot odds' decide that for you!
So also keep in mind: if you think your opponent is drawing 4 to a flush..play defense...jam it, so theres no decision to make if in fact he hits, and you now have to pay off a silly river bet again.

these theories could be related to your results.

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

I have several questions:

1)Do you feel that it is a key part of your game?

Yes! Poker is a math game, that is all. It is solely about calculating equity aganist your opponents range. If you can't do this, then you will fail.

That said, some people play poker well and do not have an "academic" understanding of the math. What these individuals do have is an instinctual understanding of the math, that they can not express into words or symbols.

Basically, they understand the math perfectly, they just can't explain their understanding to other individuals. That makes them bad teachers, but not bad poker players.

I do think that any of these individuals would certainly benefit from formal training on the math. Often times when you explain the math to these individuals and it clicks for them; they say something along the lines "oh! thats something i've always done, but now I can see why it is the right play"

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

2)Can you be successful and still struggle with this part of your game?

Yes, See above

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

3)What can I do to get better at this?

Practice! Study and Post. I do most of my posting at cardplayer, cause that is where I started and there is still a pretty good core left. Anywhere you go though there should be some math guys around to help you.

Poker is hard work if want to fully understand the math. It will take time and be really frustrating for you if you don't have a background in that sort of thing. Eventually you'll get it though and it will all seem really easy to you.

GL

 

Originally Posted by phyzer23

not to bash or anything but pot odds are overrated

Are you trying to say that implied odds are more important than pot odds or are you actually saying that odds in general are overrated?

 

Originally Posted by rayspizza

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

I have several questions:

1)Do you feel that it is a key part of your game?

Yes! Poker is a math game, that is all. It is solely about calculating equity aganist your opponents range. If you can't do this, then you will fail.

That said, some people play poker well and do not have an "academic" understanding of the math. What these individuals do have is an instinctual understanding of the math, that they can not express into words or symbols.

Basically, they understand the math perfectly, they just can't explain their understanding to other individuals. That makes them bad teachers, but not bad poker players.

I do think that any of these individuals would certainly benefit from formal training on the math. Often times when you explain the math to these individuals and it clicks for them; they say something along the lines "oh! thats something i've always done, but now I can see why it is the right play"

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

2)Can you be successful and still struggle with this part of your game?

Yes, See above

 

Originally Posted by Presnell

3)What can I do to get better at this?

Practice! Study and Post. I do most of my posting at cardplayer, cause that is where I started and there is still a pretty good core left. Anywhere you go though there should be some math guys around to help you.

Poker is hard work if want to fully understand the math. It will take time and be really frustrating for you if you don't have a background in that sort of thing. Eventually you'll get it though and it will all seem really easy to you.

GL

so this post was referring to pot odds right?...Calculating equity is much more an important part of the game indeed.