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Correct or do I find a fold here...

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  1. daughton daughton is offline

    London
    United Kingdom

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 4:23pm)

    I almost folded this pre flop but I'm not supposed to raise/fold with a 30BB stack right?

    I had a similar hand the other day and people pointed out that the small raise in this situation is indicative of a big hand. But tell me, I'm not seriously supposed to find a fold here am I?

    As played if I don't shove the flop and he does, I'm calling so once i call pre the money's all going in anyway??
    .
    pokerstars Hand #76133770676: Tournament #518870193, $4.00+$0.40 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XIX (600/1200) - 2012/02/24 16:15:48 WET [2012/02/24 11:15:48 ET]
    Table '518870193 12' 8-max Seat #6 is the button
    Seat 1: Koi111 (64335 in chips)
    Seat 2: daughton (33558 in chips)
    Seat 4: Ca$hPredator (43582 in chips)
    Seat 5: SVW1904 (40103 in chips)
    Seat 6: Raveken (63506 in chips)
    Seat 7: Pseudo Fruto (70910 in chips)
    Seat 8: Fruitsla (47164 in chips)
    Koi111: posts the ante 150
    daughton: posts the ante 150
    Ca$hPredator: posts the ante 150
    SVW1904: posts the ante 150
    Raveken: posts the ante 150
    Pseudo Fruto: posts the ante 150
    Fruitsla: posts the ante 150
    Pseudo Fruto: posts small blind 600
    Fruitsla: posts big blind 1200

    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to daughton [Tc Ts]
    Koi111: folds
    daughton: raises 1480 to 2680
    Ca$hPredator: folds
    SVW1904: raises 3320 to 6000
    Raveken: folds
    Pseudo Fruto: folds
    Fruitsla: folds
    daughton: calls 3320

    *** FLOP *** [7d 4c 3c]

    daughton: bets 27408 and is all-in

    SVW1904: calls 27408

    *** TURN *** [7d 4c 3c] [5s]

    *** RIVER *** [7d 4c 3c 5s] [8c]

    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    daughton: shows [Tc Ts] (a pair of Tens)
    SVW1904: shows [Js Jh] (a pair of Jacks)
    SVW1904 collected 69666 from pot
    daughton finished the tournament in 59th place and received $10.99.

    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 69666 | Rake 0
    Board [7d 4c 3c 5s 8c]
    Seat 1: Koi111 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 2: daughton showed [Tc Ts] and lost with a pair of Tens
    Seat 4: Ca$hPredator folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 5: SVW1904 showed [Js Jh] and won (69666) with a pair of Jacks
    Seat 6: Raveken (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 7: Pseudo Fruto (small blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 8: Fruitsla (big blind) folded before Flop
    Edited By: daughton Feb 24th, 2012 at 04:27 PM
  2. BenFaz BenFaz is offline

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 4:29pm) in reply to daughton

    You can raise/fold with a 30 bb stack, Did you have any stats on this guy? I mean if he is a nit im folding not flatting, If he is been pretty active im jamming.
    908 
  3. RedIceRap RedIceRap is offline Redirator

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 4:52pm) in reply to BenFaz

    yeah we need more info. against a nit this is an easy fold pre. table is 7handed right? this could make it difficult to let it go. i recommend u play with ranges in pokerstove and decide urself what a lose or tight range is. i mean if i look at my HUD and see a red colored 3bet stat this prolly will be a fold preflop.

    i make the call u made sometimes, but only to get more money there. if i make that call pre then i def think villain is either very agro or stupid. so if i think villain has 86s in his range there's no point in reshoving pre. but, villain also needs to be very agro on the flop, and stack sizes indicate that there's a good chance that a very agro player gonna get the money in post flop nomatter if he hits or not.

    so, if the board is K high i dont care if i lose against AK there, since the money wouldve gonne in preflop anyway if i wouldve shoved. but it's always nice to see someone representing a king postflop, calling him down with tens and see somth like 57o. again, it has to be the right villain!

    on the flop, ur shove makes zero sense. maybe 88 and 99 gonna call, that's about everything that u beat. u need to induce bluffs there. u can even donk bet small and snap call his shove or whatever, but just shoving there oop really doesnt make sense.
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  4. daughton daughton is offline

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 5:17pm) in reply to RedIceRap

    Ok, thanks for the feed back again.

    He had been pretty quiet and I hadn't seen him get out of line. My first thought was that his raise spooked me a bit but.....I guess I just rushed. Thinking about it he didn't seem like a player who would RR less than TT and he is probs only doing it with pps so he has to have TT+

    AQ prob doesn't RR here and Ak prob shoves on me. I know this gives him a very tight range to RR here but I hadn't noticed him RR before.

    Is this thinking correct or am I just making it fit the outcome?
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  5. Sagacious Man Sagacious Man is offline

    Australia

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 9:57pm) in reply to daughton

    you can definately raise fold 30bbs. The shove on the flop is not good at all, because you push out most worse hands he could have. If you check, he bets, then you shove at least you get a bit more value from something like AK. The way you played the hand by shoving, you get no extra value if you're ahead and lose everything when you are beat...

    I don't agree that you can rule out AK at all, against some players you can rule out AQ. If he was tighht as you say then probably he has JJ+ or AK, and this range crushes you so you can just fold. Against a looser player this is an easy jam but not against a nit.
  6. RedIceRap RedIceRap is offline Redirator

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    Feb 24th, 2012 (2/24/2012 10:05pm) in reply to daughton

     
    Originally Posted by daughton View Post

    Ok, thanks for the feed back again.

    He had been pretty quiet and I hadn't seen him get out of line. My first thought was that his raise spooked me a bit but.....I guess I just rushed. Thinking about it he didn't seem like a player who would RR less than TT and he is probs only doing it with pps so he has to have TT+

    AQ prob doesn't RR here and Ak prob shoves on me. I know this gives him a very tight range to RR here but I hadn't noticed him RR before.

    Is this thinking correct or am I just making it fit the outcome?

    yes ur correct here. AK doesnt necessarily reshove for 30bb. people tend to do that rather OOP than IP.
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  7. djdoodoo djdoodoo is offline

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    Feb 25th, 2012 (2/25/2012 12:40am) in reply to RedIceRap

    Donk jamming here vs 3bet when your ep is horrible
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