warning: long

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Hand #57067861-27 at 7pm7K-Final (No Limit tournament Hold'em)Started at 19/Sep/08 00:30:53
trailerAces is at seat 0 with 255690.
jakesteff777 is at seat 1 with 267630.
SumRaNd0mGuY is at seat 2 with 162520.
Chadillac is at seat 4 with 193100.
brad54321 is at seat 5 with 419480.
Trigger Happy is at seat 6 with 235060.
goodtrysucka is at seat 7 with 375690.
cezario1 is at seat 9 with 417330.
The button is at seat 4.
trailerAces posts ante (1200).
jakesteff777 posts ante (1200).
SumRaNd0mGuY posts ante (1200).
Chadillac posts ante (1200).
brad54321 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts ante (1200).
goodtrysucka posts ante (1200).
cezario1 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts the small blind of 6000.
goodtrysucka posts the big blind of 12000.
trailerAces: Qc 5s
jakesteff777: -- --
SumRaNd0mGuY: -- --
Chadillac: -- --
brad54321: -- --
Trigger Happy: -- --
goodtrysucka: -- --
cezario1: -- --
Pre-flop: cezario1 calls.
trailerAces folds. jakesteff777 folds.
SumRaNd0mGuY folds.
Chadillac folds.
brad54321 folds.
Trigger Happy calls.
goodtrysucka raises to 40000.
cezario1 calls.
Trigger Happy folds.
Flop (board: 8s 3d Js):
goodtrysucka bets 42000.
cezario1 raises to 84000.
goodtrysucka re-raises to 142000.
cezario1 goes all-in for 376130.
goodtrysucka folds.
cezario1 is returned 234130 (uncalled).

Hand #57067861-27 Summary:
No rake is taken for this hand.
cezario1 wins 385600.
----------------------------------------------------------------

This hand happened at the final table of the 5rebuy 7k guaranteed on UB last night.
My husband sent an email to UB asking them to investigate.

This was the response:

Dear David:

Thank you for letting us know about what you witnessed at the tables.

A single incident of collusion is often difficult to prove conclusively, with the exception of the most obvious cases. When we are confronted with the possibility of chip dumping between two players, we will not only review the game in question, but also all incidents of the suspected players' actions together. We look into the players' history to analyze their play in the past and to determine if other players are involved.

At times, we can prove conclusively that cheating occurred. In most cases, we can also determine that the players were definitely not cheating; and what appeared as chip dumping, to one in the game or observing the table, is merely a coincidence.

If we notice a pattern of unusual activity then we will take action. It is against our policy to reveal any actions taken against another account. Therefore, the actions taken against those suspected of cheating cannot be discussed with anyone but the account holder.

We want to thank you again for bringing this possible chip dumping activity to our attention. Please feel free to contact us if you have any further questions or comments.

Best regards,

Federico
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

Note the contrast of this response to the one previous time that he asked them to investigate possible cheating:

Dear David,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have reviewed the account in question but we did not find evidence of "superuser" activity from him; and we can assure you that he is not a UB employee. However; we will keep an eye on him to make sure he plays following our regulations.

Remember that you can always provide us with specific table and hand numbers whenever you suspect cheating is taking place.

Please let us know if you require any assistance.

Best regards,

Sebastian
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

In the current email they tell him they may or may not have noticed cheating and if they did they cannot discuss action.

In the old email they explicitly assured him no wrongdoing took place.

He believes that IF the two accounts chip dumped they should both be disqualifed and everyone left in at this hand be moved up 2 prize levels.

He also believes that due to the nature of the email something fishy was found between these two players.

Possible reasons a chip dump might be done here are to "create a chipleader" or if two friends are playing 2 accounts or one person is playing 2 accounts and a "bustO" hand is dealt (AA and KK pre, one gets KK and one get 88, etc they would need to make it look like the player with the hand that should get stacked "figured it out" before he got allin)

I posted this for him because he doesnt have a P5s account.
I am neutral it does look funny but we dont live together anymore so I didnt even know he was playing last night.

Please respond with
a) if the hand history/email combo looks like cheating was or wasnt involved to you
b) if cheating was involved how should it be handled?

thanks,

welshFARg0

Looks like those two were already among the chip leaders at the table.

(a) Doesn't seem like anything but blind making a move on the pre-flop raiser.

(b) When the pre-flop raiser pushed, the blind player determined his bluff would not work and elected to save chips for playing.

(c) I don't see anything 'cheating' related. Unless you left something out, this is just poker.

(d) I have reported suspicious activity in the past. The secrity response you received is standard. They can not give you the results unless cheating is proved. They are not allowed to slander their customers without cause. Every customer is afforded some degree of privacy until they have good cause to dismiss the customer.

 

Originally Posted by welshFARg0

warning: long

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hand #57067861-27 at 7pm7K-Final (No Limit tournament Hold'em)Started at 19/Sep/08 00:30:53
trailerAces is at seat 0 with 255690.
jakesteff777 is at seat 1 with 267630.
SumRaNd0mGuY is at seat 2 with 162520.
Chadillac is at seat 4 with 193100.
brad54321 is at seat 5 with 419480.
Trigger Happy is at seat 6 with 235060.
goodtrysucka is at seat 7 with 375690.
cezario1 is at seat 9 with 417330.
The button is at seat 4.
trailerAces posts ante (1200).
jakesteff777 posts ante (1200).
SumRaNd0mGuY posts ante (1200).
Chadillac posts ante (1200).
brad54321 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts ante (1200).
goodtrysucka posts ante (1200).
cezario1 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts the small blind of 6000.
goodtrysucka posts the big blind of 12000.
trailerAces: Qc 5s
jakesteff777: -- --
SumRaNd0mGuY: -- --
Chadillac: -- --
brad54321: -- --
Trigger Happy: -- --
goodtrysucka: -- --
cezario1: -- --
Pre-flop: cezario1 calls.
trailerAces folds. jakesteff777 folds.
SumRaNd0mGuY folds.
Chadillac folds.
brad54321 folds.
Trigger Happy calls.
goodtrysucka raises to 40000.
cezario1 calls.
Trigger Happy folds.
Flop (board: 8s 3d Js):
goodtrysucka bets 42000.
cezario1 raises to 84000.
goodtrysucka re-raises to 142000.
cezario1 goes all-in for 376130.
goodtrysucka folds.
cezario1 is returned 234130 (uncalled).

Hand #57067861-27 Summary:
No rake is taken for this hand.
cezario1 wins 385600.
----------------------------------------------------------------

This hand happened at the final table of the 5rebuy 7k guaranteed on UB last night.
My husband sent an email to UB asking them to investigate.

This was the response:

Dear David:

Thank you for letting us know about what you witnessed at the tables.

A single incident of collusion is often difficult to prove conclusively, with the exception of the most obvious cases. When we are confronted with the possibility of chip dumping between two players, we will not only review the game in question, but also all incidents of the suspected players' actions together. We look into the players' history to analyze their play in the past and to determine if other players are involved.

At times, we can prove conclusively that cheating occurred. In most cases, we can also determine that the players were definitely not cheating; and what appeared as chip dumping, to one in the game or observing the table, is merely a coincidence.

If we notice a pattern of unusual activity then we will take action. It is against our policy to reveal any actions taken against another account. Therefore, the actions taken against those suspected of cheating cannot be discussed with anyone but the account holder.

We want to thank you again for bringing this possible chip dumping activity to our attention. Please feel free to contact us if you have any further questions or comments.

Best regards,

Federico
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

Note the contrast of this response to the one previous time that he asked them to investigate possible cheating:

Dear David,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have reviewed the account in question but we did not find evidence of "superuser" activity from him; and we can assure you that he is not a UB employee. However; we will keep an eye on him to make sure he plays following our regulations.

Remember that you can always provide us with specific table and hand numbers whenever you suspect cheating is taking place.

Please let us know if you require any assistance.

Best regards,

Sebastian
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

In the current email they tell him they may or may not have noticed cheating and if they did they cannot discuss action.

In the old email they explicitly assured him no wrongdoing took place.

He believes that IF the two accounts chip dumped they should both be disqualifed and everyone left in at this hand be moved up 2 prize levels.

He also believes that due to the nature of the email something fishy was found between these two players.

Possible reasons a chip dump might be done here are to "create a chipleader" or if two friends are playing 2 accounts or one person is playing 2 accounts and a "bustO" hand is dealt (AA and KK pre, one gets KK and one get 88, etc they would need to make it look like the player with the hand that should get stacked "figured it out" before he got allin)

I posted this for him because he doesnt have a P5s account.
I am neutral it does look funny but we dont live together anymore so I didnt even know he was playing last night.

Please respond with
a) if the hand history/email combo looks like cheating was or wasnt involved to you
b) if cheating was involved how should it be handled?

thanks,

welshFARg0

Just Looks lik ehe Got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and Opted to GTFO ..

This is just a bluff gone wrong, and neither player necessarily even played the hand incorrectly.

There's nothing suspicious about this hand.

 

Originally Posted by Jokerluelz

 

Originally Posted by welshFARg0

warning: long

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hand #57067861-27 at 7pm7K-Final (No Limit tournament Hold'em)Started at 19/Sep/08 00:30:53
trailerAces is at seat 0 with 255690.
jakesteff777 is at seat 1 with 267630.
SumRaNd0mGuY is at seat 2 with 162520.
Chadillac is at seat 4 with 193100.
brad54321 is at seat 5 with 419480.
Trigger Happy is at seat 6 with 235060.
goodtrysucka is at seat 7 with 375690.
cezario1 is at seat 9 with 417330.
The button is at seat 4.
trailerAces posts ante (1200).
jakesteff777 posts ante (1200).
SumRaNd0mGuY posts ante (1200).
Chadillac posts ante (1200).
brad54321 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts ante (1200).
goodtrysucka posts ante (1200).
cezario1 posts ante (1200).
Trigger Happy posts the small blind of 6000.
goodtrysucka posts the big blind of 12000.
trailerAces: Qc 5s
jakesteff777: -- --
SumRaNd0mGuY: -- --
Chadillac: -- --
brad54321: -- --
Trigger Happy: -- --
goodtrysucka: -- --
cezario1: -- --
Pre-flop: cezario1 calls.
trailerAces folds. jakesteff777 folds.
SumRaNd0mGuY folds.
Chadillac folds.
brad54321 folds.
Trigger Happy calls.
goodtrysucka raises to 40000.
cezario1 calls.
Trigger Happy folds.
Flop (board: 8s 3d Js):
goodtrysucka bets 42000.
cezario1 raises to 84000.
goodtrysucka re-raises to 142000.
cezario1 goes all-in for 376130.
goodtrysucka folds.
cezario1 is returned 234130 (uncalled).

Hand #57067861-27 Summary:
No rake is taken for this hand.
cezario1 wins 385600.
----------------------------------------------------------------

This hand happened at the final table of the 5rebuy 7k guaranteed on UB last night.
My husband sent an email to UB asking them to investigate.

This was the response:

Dear David:

Thank you for letting us know about what you witnessed at the tables.

A single incident of collusion is often difficult to prove conclusively, with the exception of the most obvious cases. When we are confronted with the possibility of chip dumping between two players, we will not only review the game in question, but also all incidents of the suspected players' actions together. We look into the players' history to analyze their play in the past and to determine if other players are involved.

At times, we can prove conclusively that cheating occurred. In most cases, we can also determine that the players were definitely not cheating; and what appeared as chip dumping, to one in the game or observing the table, is merely a coincidence.

If we notice a pattern of unusual activity then we will take action. It is against our policy to reveal any actions taken against another account. Therefore, the actions taken against those suspected of cheating cannot be discussed with anyone but the account holder.

We want to thank you again for bringing this possible chip dumping activity to our attention. Please feel free to contact us if you have any further questions or comments.

Best regards,

Federico
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

Note the contrast of this response to the one previous time that he asked them to investigate possible cheating:

Dear David,

Thank you for contacting us.

We have reviewed the account in question but we did not find evidence of "superuser" activity from him; and we can assure you that he is not a UB employee. However; we will keep an eye on him to make sure he plays following our regulations.

Remember that you can always provide us with specific table and hand numbers whenever you suspect cheating is taking place.

Please let us know if you require any assistance.

Best regards,

Sebastian
UltimateBet ~ Security Department
'The Ultimate Poker Experience'

In the current email they tell him they may or may not have noticed cheating and if they did they cannot discuss action.

In the old email they explicitly assured him no wrongdoing took place.

He believes that IF the two accounts chip dumped they should both be disqualifed and everyone left in at this hand be moved up 2 prize levels.

He also believes that due to the nature of the email something fishy was found between these two players.

Possible reasons a chip dump might be done here are to "create a chipleader" or if two friends are playing 2 accounts or one person is playing 2 accounts and a "bustO" hand is dealt (AA and KK pre, one gets KK and one get 88, etc they would need to make it look like the player with the hand that should get stacked "figured it out" before he got allin)

I posted this for him because he doesnt have a P5s account.
I am neutral it does look funny but we dont live together anymore so I didnt even know he was playing last night.

Please respond with
a) if the hand history/email combo looks like cheating was or wasnt involved to you
b) if cheating was involved how should it be handled?

thanks,

welshFARg0

Just Looks lik ehe Got caught with his hand in the cookie jar and Opted to GTFO ..

I just made it longer...

no need to see ghosts everywhere you look,this seems perfectly normal i been in that spot many times just sayin OOOOOPS I GET CAUGHT.!!!!!