Okay---this was a gnarly spot late in the 6 handed tourney. Our table was 4 handed and I think there were approx. 9 people left in tourney.

I reraised the chip leader who was immediately to my left--anticipating to take the pot down right
there. Then, the shorter stack to my left moves all in (with what looks like no fold equity).

I am getting great odds to call, but I can only put him on a bigger A or a pocket pair (likely above my 9 since he 4-bet shoved after I 3-bet the chip leader)---leaving me with 3 outs. At least, that was my thought process as the hand was happening. I laid it down as you can see---mainly because I thought I was completely dominated and I still had enough chips, if I folded, to steal blinds by shoving.

Obviously, the rail crucified me with "ever heard of pots odds..." etc, after I folded.

What is your play? Did I leave enough room to fold?

Thanks.

Full Tilt Poker Game #5589058524: $30,000 Guarantee
(42469337), Table 44 - 1500/3000 Ante 400 - No Limit
Hold'em - 3:39:26 ET - 2008/03/11
Seat 1: rizniles (54,176)
Seat 2: jocourier (48,250)
Seat 5: voff voff voff (135,598)
Seat 6: willcutyou (290,730)
rizniles antes 400
jocourier antes 400
voff voff voff antes 400
willcutyou antes 400
rizniles posts the small blind of 1,500
jocourier posts the big blind of 3,000
The button is in seat #6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to rizniles [Ac 9d]
voff voff voff folds
willcutyou raises to 7,500
voff voff voff: simply flop flushes, my friend
voff voff voff: easy game
rizniles raises to 24,000
jocourier raises to 47,850, and is all in
willcutyou folds
rizniles has 15 seconds left to act
rizniles is sitting out
rizniles has timed out
rizniles folds
Uncalled bet of 23,850 returned to jocourier
jocourier mucks
jocourier wins the pot (57,100)
rizniles has returned
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 57,100 | Rake 0
Seat 1: rizniles (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 2: jocourier (big blind) collected (57,100),
mucked
Seat 5: voff voff voff folded before the Flop
Seat 6: willcutyou (button) folded before the Flop

Thanks dyzalot. I know you are a good player. I had it at approx 2.5 :1 (23K to call into 57K pot)---but do you always call given the situation?

This is definagtely a call and I agree with dyzalot that you should have just moved in here. I mean you rerased half of your stack almost and were absolutely pot commited. I'm sure like many players that it looked like a tough situation but its really not. Yeah it sucks that your praying to have some good outs but there is just too much in there to fold. Next time shove and most likely you take it down right there but occasionally someone behind or the original raiser will wake up with something.

uhh the pot is def more than 57k; 47k + 24k + 7500 + blinds and antes with only 23k to call is a SNAPPPPPP times a million

With your stack, shove preflop. As played, you have to call. You're getting more than 3:1 odds.

Even if I know I have to hit a three outer, I'm calling. You are better than 3:1 with Ax vs. AK. Only way I could fold A9 there is if the shover showed me AA.

This is what is known as a crying call sir. Its a call you have to make, but you're crying as you press the call button.

what everyone else already said.

but i would add that you should think about this before you make the raise, so that you already know if each player moves in what you are going to do. sometimes you might want to raise a little less so you can still get away, or a little more to pot committ yourself if that's what you want depending on the hand and stack sizes. maybe if you have a monster you want to raise less so it looks like you can still get away, to intice a shove.

if you do this and figure it out BEFORE the hand then you're more likely to make a better play.

in spots like this you might realize you're pot committing yourself anyway, so you may as well just shove.

so many times i see peole make a raise with like 2-3 left to act, someone moves in and they take like 2 minutes to decide what they want to do. I always think, shouldn't you do that BEFORE you make the raise, figure it out and adjust your raise amount to reflect your hand?? You'd be surprised how often bad players pot committ themselvs with marginal/weak hands without even realizing it.

pre planning ftw.

You are actually getting 3.58:1 to call, so you are closer to 4:1 than 2:1.

Call 23,850 into a pot of 85,450.

uh, i sigh and snap-call here, but if u'd like to believe otherwise, feel free

Does anyone consider the fact that if he folds he still has 11 BB and can push ATC and have similar odds to double up? I like the fold but I've also never been that close to $30K Guarantee Final table. I put him 99+ to AK considering he's making this move after a raise and reraise.

You seem to have misplayed the hand pre-flop. Do not compund the problem by folding. Get those chips in there and pray to the poker Gods!

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" bgColor=#ffffff border=0><TBODY><TR bgColor=#eeeedd><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> </TD><TD>Re(2): Folding preflop with over 2:1 odds late in tourney
by Cmoney3 on 3/11/2008 11:39 </TD><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><NOBR> </NOBR></TD><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD></TD><TD> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffff><TD bgColor=#ffffff></TD><TD colSpan=2><TABLE cellPadding=2 border=0 celspacing="0"><TBODY><TR><TD>i folded preflop gettin 2.1-1 on my money earlier this week

if u think you have 2 live cards then u need 2-1, if u think u only have one live card u need 2.3-1, anything more than 2.3-1 and its an auto call
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qftmft

quoted for the motherfuckin truth