Novathunder had been the CL for at least the last 2 hours approaching the money. Had been at the table with him for prob 10 orbits so a good amount of time. He had been all over the place, calling raises out of position, making terrible flats etc. His flatting range here is soooooo wide based on what Ive seen, so in these situations, whats the best move to extract as much as possible out of him. Over shove? Flat and see what he does postflop? Ive always felt like this is a leak in my game from the standpoint that I seem to lose alot of value in these situations.

Stage #344780361 Tourney ID 5729822 Holdem Multi Normal Tournament No Limit 2,000 - 2010-09-04 14:52:58 (ET)
Table: 3 (Real Money) Seat #2 is the dealer
Seat 1 - BOLTACTION (27,600 in chips)
Seat 2 - MACKVENOM1 (29,950 in chips)
Seat 3 - NOVATHUNDER (135,541 in chips)
Seat 4 - DANIMAL703 (64,850 in chips)
Seat 5 - MIT420 (71,505 in chips)
Seat 6 - BELLE35966 (15,175 in chips)
Seat 7 - IDISPI (140,045 in chips)
Seat 8 - AIRCAV SCOUT (29,235 in chips)
Seat 9 - 10ACESTR8 (19,679 in chips)
BOLTACTION - Ante 200
MACKVENOM1 - Ante 200
NOVATHUNDER - Ante 200
DANIMAL703 - Ante 200
MIT420 - Ante 200
BELLE35966 - Ante 200
IDISPI - Ante 200
AIRCAV SCOUT - Ante 200
10ACESTR8 - Ante 200
NOVATHUNDER - Posts small blind 1,000
DANIMAL703 - Posts big blind 2,000
*** POCKET CARDS ***
Dealt to DANIMAL703 [Ks Kh]
MIT420 - Folds
BELLE35966 - All-In(Raise) 14,975 to 14,975
IDISPI - Folds
AIRCAV SCOUT - Folds
10ACESTR8 - Folds
BOLTACTION - Folds
MACKVENOM1 - Folds
NOVATHUNDER - Calls 13,975
DANIMAL703 - ????

Depends on if you want to defend your hand or not. I would re-raise it to like 34k and then just push on the flop (or call his semi-) however you have to figure he may have Ax and a Axx flop could kill you. He won't call an all-in here preflop if you push (its 1/2 his stack) so if you want to maximize profits re-raise and push, otherwise push pre and take a decent pot.

Really don't hate a flat. A high flop you lose anyway considering 1 of them most likely has Ax. If he has like 40% of hands here, just let him connect and get it in on the flop. If you think he is never folding than just shove

Personnaly I still think this is a shove 100% of the time although the posts above r certainly all valid options. I will attempt to explain why

1. Granted if we shove the villian has to commit 50% of his chips to call. If he is as wild as u suggest he will likely call a % of the time. This will also depend on how he perceives ur image - obv if this perception is tight he is folding in this case. However even with a shove he may feel he is getting sufficiently attractive odds to call (not mathematically but do see this happen way too often). If he is ur typical ultralag wannabee he will call as to back down is not in his playbook
2. U stand to gain 40% in ur stack here by isolating the all in providing ur hand holds.
3. If ur intention is to shove any non A flop here in any case why let him hit cheaply particulary with trash - make him pay 4 his draw imo.
If he whiffs the flop is he calling ur shove on the flop in any case?
Is he likely to lead out the flop or just check? It would not surprise me if he leads out with air on a % of flops
4 sure he may make a pr on the flop but most the time he will air it - how will u be getting extra value then? and this is without considering the times he makes a hand that cracks urs.

I realise ur question is whether u r missing equity by shoving - given that u will not always win the hand at showdown, given that he will not always call ur flop bet, but conversely that u can get away from an A on the flop potentially saving chips (which he may rep with or without one on the flop to isolate in any case (see this way too often)) it is difficult to say but with a loose player I think we also get our shove called often enough here.

In this situation I would rather win a nice pot safely than bust out on a fancy play which often may not be paid off or may even be cracked.

I welcome anybodies comments on my thoughts here as I see this as an interesting situation and an opportunity to learn from far better players

I'd shove. if he is that nutty, he'll call your shove some higher % of the time then people with a clue and rewrad you.

i see hands that he will call your shove with pre that he might get away from post if u let him see a flop... so i think getting max value is shoving.

Just shove so you can get it over with without clicking any more buttons.

How perceptive do you think he is? Against a lot of players who I think are only first or second level thinkers I'll flat here because he's just focused on his hand/riding the wave of his sack. But if you think he knows you don't have to be super strong to iso shove then just throw the heaps in.

depends on his postflop play. I think I agree with everyone ITT if that's possible. pretty much shove, flat, or cib all seems fine to me. Maybe he'll call, maybe he wont. Whatever. But I lean towards a shove as the standard play even against very active opponents because that's what I'd do with the rest of my range... unless you think you can get him to put it all in on some flops he misses and most or all flops he hits but not hard enough to beat you. Like some of the last few posters are saying, go ahead and minraise if you think he's silly enough to call it or spaz out and shove over the top. That definitely seems ideal.

Jam all day.

 

Originally Posted by Deoxyribo

make it 30k if hes as bad as u say

this it works a lot of the time he will flat your min bet because he is getting such good ods then he will snap fold any flop he misses