Ok - Not sure if any of you have heard of the CardRunners promotion they where having. All the members would play in a free roll tourney and top 4 would get to chose a CR pro (GREEN PLASTIC, MUDDYWATTER, JSUP, or FILTHYWATYER) and recieve 50% of their winnings for the night.
I fortunately won the tournament and am stuck with a decision...
I obviously can pick any one of the pros (GREEN PLASTIC obviously) or can choose to split 25% of all the4 pro's winnings.....
The thing with me is - GP could have a HUGE night (20K) or he could have a losing session, meaning I would be just refunded my CR membership of $200
I have the option of chopping it 4 ways or even 2 ways with the person who got 2nd place...
What I have in mind right now is 50% of GP's and JSups winnings.... (muddywatter is killing me)
Please let me know what you guys would do - more prefrably from the ranked players that play with these guys...
Thanks - I will have some time to think about this....
IM NOT RANKED BUT THIS IS A NO BRAINER
PICK GP 50%
There is really only one decision. No offense to the other guys but take 50% of GP. If he has a minimal winning night at the levels that he plays, it will be more than you would get from the other guy's having a good night.
you have to go with muddy on this one. he six tables 5-10 on party and absolutely crushes the game. he probably makes more money multitabling than taylor would make playing his one table of 50-100. plus, since he's 6 tabling one session isn't subject to as much short term variance as GP would be potentially be playing with (esp. if he plays mahatma).
is there a specific amt of time minimum or maximum he is going to play for??
cause I mean I would def pick GP but I would want him to be playing like 6 straight hours at 50/100 lol.
i don't have an answer...but what a promotion!
Not saying this to convince Moose--he's already heard it--but just want to throw this out there for everyone's consideration.
I played this tournament like a sat instead of a normal tournament, because as far as I was concerned, top four places were pretty equal. GP, jsup, muddywater, and filthy--we're talking about four top players here. So would you rather have 100% of Phil Ivey in the WSOP, or would you take 25% of Ivey, Harrington, Brunson, and Chan? For me, it's a no brainer--you reduce your varience and take pieces of all four. I said all along that whatever place I finished, I thought it made sense for the final four to each take 25% of each pro.
All four pros will be motivated to put in their best performance and hopefully will do well, but when you're talking about poker, anyone can have a losing session. Sure, GP plays the highest limits so he certainly has the greatest moneymaking potential, but like all great players, he's not going to win everyday. He plays an extremely high varience style at 50/100 and up. He can lose 10k in a night just as easily as he can win 30k.
If you really want to gamble and don't care about the money, I can see going with just GP for that possibility of a huge night, but you're turning down a sure thing for that chance of greater return. If everyone takes a piece of all four, everyone is practically guaranteed to make some good money on this. Just my thoughts.
Thanks so much to Cardrunners for running this promotion, by the way. It was unique and a lot of fun. Great site if you're serious about improving your game.
I know exactly what you are saying Jdog - it is a great idea. But I dont think I will pass up on GP having a 10K win night or 20K win night. I am a mid level player and 5K, 10K, or even 15K night is just unbelievable for me. It will tremendously help out my bankroll and will improve my game like you wouldn't believe.
I am having a hard decsision between Muddywater and Jsup. I use to follow both of them on UB - but they dont seem to play on their anymore atleast with those screen names. Filthy I know plays the 1K SnG's and 1000NL on party and might be a solid choice, but I only can pick two.
Again - I would appreciate some of the higher ranked players thoughts on this tough decision.
Thanks and you guys wont believe how excited I am!
It seems there was a little confusion about what the prize of this freeroll was. Every member who joined CardRunners during the first month was eligible for a spot in this freeroll. The winner of the freeroll gets to pick one pro to get 50% of his winnings for one day. The runner-up gets to choose from the other available players, and so on.
You can NOT choose 25% of all four players, this doesn't add up to the same as 50% of one player and was not part of the original promotion. Sorry about the confusion.
For what it's worth, here is what i would consider if i was in your spot. I would choose between myself and Andrew. My logic follows...
depends on what you prefer - Andrew multitables 5/10 and 10/25nl, has very few losing days because he plays 4-6 tables at a time. Probably has an expected value of around 1-1.5k.
i play 1-3 tables of 25-50nl or 50-100nl. my games are almost always short handed and are usually against pretty stiff competition. i have winning days about 70% of the time, with EV being around 3.5k.
i'd be interested to see what everyone else out there would choose...thoughts?
Thanks to everyone who has participated in this promotion. We are going to run a new promotion in a few weeks so stay tuned (biggest self promotion ever).
OK!!!! Sign me UP! That is like the best promotion I have ever heard.
Hand #10130276-492 at Sussex (No Limit Hold'em)
Powered by UltimateBet
Started at 08/Dec/05 11:46:00
PhilHellmuth is at seat 0 with $4496.
nojja is at seat 1 with $20000 (sitting out).
Green Plastic is at seat 5 with $26090.50.
mungle is at seat 6 with $32389.50.
The button is at seat 5.
mungle posts the small blind of $100.
PhilHellmuth posts the big blind of $200.
PhilHellmuth: -- --
Green Plastic: -- --
mungle: -- --
Green Plastic raises to $700. mungle re-raises to
$2300. PhilHellmuth folds. Green Plastic calls.
Flop (board: 7s 7h Js):
mungle bets $3000. Green Plastic calls.
Turn (board: 7s 7h Js 9c):
mungle bets $7500. Green Plastic calls.
River (board: 7s 7h Js 9c Qc):
mungle goes all-in for $19589.50. Green Plastic goes
all-in for $13290.50. mungle is returned $6299
mungle shows Ad 7d.
mungle has Ad 7d 7s 7h Qc: three sevens.
Green Plastic shows Jh Jd.
Green Plastic has Jh Jd 7s 7h Js: full house, jacks full of sevens.
Hand #10130276-492 Summary:
$1 is raked from a pot of $52381.
Green Plastic wins $52380 with full house, jacks full of sevens.
This is all about risk-reward my friend. You can either run a great risk of getting nothing but the membership refund by going with GP, or you can run very little risk and likely profit around $1k with Muddy. That being said, if you take the greater risk of going with GP (his shorthanded gameplay involves a lot of variance) then you may also potentially get a huge pay day. I don't know how much of a risk taker you are, but I'd have to go with GP for the windfall. I'd take the risk to make $10,000 or a hell of a lot more if GP has a huge day. You're likely not going to get another shot like this for a long time if ever. Ultimately up to you though bro.
GL to your pro
Exactly. I would much rather take a risk at making 10k than going for a safe 1k. Not saying that Muddy can only make 1k a day because I am sure there are days where he makes a lot more than that. After all you did win this on a freeroll. I would go for the most even if it involves the most risk.
Go with Taylor...you'll kick yourself if you go for the "safer" play and GP ends up winning big.
rjup...i don't think 70% is a great risk...GP hands down
GP, what I was proposing was swapping percentages to reduce varience, so when I say 100% of one player or 25% of four, I don't mean 100% or 25% of your action, I mean that percentage of our equity in the player. So right now everyone has 50% of one pro, which is waht I was referring to as our 100%. My suggestion is that we each take a quarter of our share of each pro rather than 100% of one pro each. In other words, we each could take 12.5% of each of your action rather than 50% of one's action. Curious what you think of the ev of such a swap.
Even if Moose didn't want a piece of all four pros, I would think it would be in his best interest to swap a percentage with at least one of the other winners and take 25% of you and 25% of Andrew (or one of the other pros) or some such arrangement. Thoughts?
I think that GP is awesome but Muddywater is just so consistent. He isn't as flashy as GP because he isnt taking down 50k pots but he is consistent. I never seem him down money at a table.
Since the 25% of 4 players is out I think you have to take a shot with your "freeroll". GP playes the biggest stakes and there is the potential for a huge payday there. And if not at least you took your best shot and the bigger $$$.
If you did have the option for 25% of all, that would have been the way to go. Would practically negate the short term negative variance aspect of it.
Swapping percentages/pooling is still an option, mentioned (even encouraged a little) by muddywater on the CR boards. I think GP was concerned that there was confusion about how much of each pro we got--he saw 100% and 25% each and was thinking, no you each only get 50% of the pro's action, 25 times 4 is 100% not 50%, and so forth. Really just a misunderstanding--if we each take 25% of the four pros, we're each getting 12.5% of each of the pros' action.
Although I have been keenly following the tournament scene for a while now, I am very new to the cash game scene. In your opinions, who are the top ten or online nl cash game players in the world ordered 1 to 10 1 being the best? Is mahatma the best? Green plastic? I have only recently begun to watch these guys, and I do not know how much money they are making or anything like that but I can't say I'm not curious, as most of the people I've talked to all have confirmed that they are making a LOT more money the top tourney players are. So what do you guys know?
GP > Mahatma
GP easily, say he has a huge night and is up 30k, u get 15k right? Easy choice, you're not losing anything
Green Plastic and others...
Sorry that I was mis-understood, I never wanted a 4 way chop "25% to each player" and thats why I wanted to play it out to the final 2.
I proposed that me and the 2nd place finisher split the winnings equally between Green Plastic and Muddywater... - that is the only way I 'chop/pool'
If joyce48 doesnt want to do that - then I go with you Green Plastic - easy.
P.S. Green Plastic and/or Muddywater - please add me to your MSN Messanger: firstname.lastname@example.org
If I was a low limit player, I would definitely do a pooling of some sort. As GP said, he probably only wins 60% of his sessions. He just wins more when he wins opposed to when he loses. I would say that normally I'd be a very good bet. I was had a very good, prolonged run. However, the last week has been awful for me. I hit a wall. I guess it was going to happen sooner or later. Nothing huge, it's just I'm having trouble pulling out the wins for the last week. Another thing to consider is that jsup is HOT. He is making 18 final tables a day. Phil is also VERY underrated. He had wanted to keep his UB name secret, but he changed his mind. He plays under Plush Luxy on UB. If you watch the higher stakes games, I'm sure you've seen him tear it up sometime in the last month or so since he got on UB. The truth is that someone very well might go home with nothing if there is no pooling, but that definitely will not be the case if you do pool. How much do you want to gamble???
Interesting points. I think for the future their should be guidlines that are locked and cannot be changed by the winners. This is going to be a really hard decision because exact details are not given...
Couple questions/idea's I have:
Say I get finalzed with Green Plastic:
1. How long will the session be 1 - 2 - 3 hours?
2. Am I able to tell him to stop and call it quits if there is a big win?
The problem I have is that I haven't followed jsup or Filthy at all in the last couple months - I dont know their screen names so I am not sure how they are doing...
I guess I will wait for joyce48 response on if he wants to pool with only me and him....
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