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Was this a horrible fold?

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  1. Nuttypoolog Nuttypoolog is offline

    United States

    Posts: 71
    Joined: Feb 05

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 12:39am)

    7 left in a $20 180 man sit n go....

    pokerstars Game #7005194410: Tournament #35760348, $20+$2 Hold'em No Limit - Level XII (800/1600) - 2006/11/13 - 01:27:35 (ET)
    Table '35760348 15' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
    Seat 3: zzbr10 (34056 in chips)
    Seat 4: Nuttypoolog (60541 in chips)
    Seat 5: auduovox (40918 in chips)
    Seat 6: AKundertaker (33444 in chips)
    Seat 7: grotan (69163 in chips)
    Seat 8: wigger20 (19468 in chips)
    Seat 9: Viperbimp5 (12410 in chips)
    zzbr10: posts the ante 75
    Nuttypoolog: posts the ante 75
    auduovox: posts the ante 75
    AKundertaker: posts the ante 75
    grotan: posts the ante 75
    wigger20: posts the ante 75
    Viperbimp5: posts the ante 75
    grotan: posts small blind 800
    wigger20: posts big blind 1600
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Nuttypoolog [Kh As]
    Viperbimp5: folds
    zzbr10: folds
    Nuttypoolog: raises 3200 to 4800
    auduovox: folds
    AKundertaker: raises 3200 to 8000
    grotan: folds
    wigger20: folds
    Nuttypoolog: calls 3200
    *** FLOP *** [9s 8s 4s]
    Nuttypoolog: checks
    AKundertaker: bets 25369 and is all-in
    Nuttypoolog: folds
    AKundertaker collected 18925 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 18925 | Rake 0
    Board [9s 8s 4s]
    Seat 3: zzbr10 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 4: Nuttypoolog folded on the Flop
    Seat 5: auduovox folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 6: AKundertaker (button) collected (18925)
    Seat 7: grotan (small blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 8: wigger20 (big blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 9: Viperbimp5 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
     
  2. holdmfoldm holdmfoldm is offline

    Montgomery, AL
    United States

    Posts: 543
    Joined: Aug 05

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 1:23am) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    No this isnt a horrible fold at all. You still have over 25bb if you fold this hand and you are still only drawing to possibly only the flush. With his reraise pre and then a shove I would put him on KK here with the K of spades. Leaving you hoping for only an A or another spade to win the hand. Good Fold IMO.
  3. Davio Davio is offline

    Antwerp
    Belgium

    Posts: 505
    Joined: Sep 05

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 1:33am) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    Let's do math:

    The pot = 44294; 25369 to call, you're getting 1.75 to 1 on your flush draw, this is sufficient for your flush draw wich has about the same odds to hit by the river.

    Factoring in that hitting one of your overcards can be good as well, since you might be up against an overpair like QQ or JJ, you're actually a slight favorite in a coinflip situation.

    <pre>pokenum -h as kh - ad ah -- 9s 8s 4s
    Holdem Hi: 990 enumerated boards containing 9s 8s 4s
    cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
    As Kh 361 36.46 629 63.54 0 0.00 0.365
    Ad Ah 629 63.54 361 36.46 0 0.00 0.635</pre>
    pokenum -h as kh - qc qd -- 9s 8s 4s Holdem Hi: 990 enumerated boards containing 9s 8s 4s
    <pre>Cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
    As Kh 510 51.52 480 48.48 0 0.00 0.515
    Qc Qd 480 48.48 510 51.52 0 0.00 0.485</pre>
    Worst case, you're up against top set or a made flush, but in either case you're not in awful shape.

    Conclusion: CALL!!!!!
  4. kissamr98 kissamr98 is offline

    Indianapolis, IN
    United States

    Posts: 546
    Joined: Apr 06

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 10:37am) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    the real question is how you finished
  5. SirDonksALot SirDonksALot is offline

    Posts: 1,166
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    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 1:33pm) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    I totally shove that flop all day with 2 overs and the nut flush draw. Easy push when you have your opponent covered and you still have a decent amount of chips if you lose. This is what it takes to win tourneys, picking spots to gamble....this is one of those spots, IMO.
  6. kissamr98 kissamr98 is offline

    Indianapolis, IN
    United States

    Posts: 546
    Joined: Apr 06

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 1:46pm) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    I wouldn't blame you for calling but why do it. He right. If you win this you are golden for the top 3 spots. If you loose then 4 out of 7.

    If u did hit....well then let the chip up begin.
  7. On The Come On The Come is offline

    Posts: 17
    Joined: Feb 06

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 1:53pm) in reply to SirDonksALot

    Maybe I'm an idiot, but as far as I see it, the mistake wasn't made on the flop, it was made PRE flop. Depending on if player AKundertaker's style of play, you should have made one of two moves. But flat calling here is a mistake pre flop. You either raise him all in, or you fold. Flat calling out of position with AK having no idea where your at is just asking for trouble. Let him have the pot right there pre flop, or shove on him having him out chipped by 2x. With AK you want to see all five cards. Period. Depending on my read on AKundertaker, I most likely shove on him here pre flop. I give him a chance to fold, and give myself a chance to see all five cards. If he has AA or KK, who cares! If you flop A or K high(top pair), you're screwed anyway! Plus, I have the confidence to shove here, and lose, knowing i still have 30k and can win this thing.

    Fold or shove pre flop, that was your mistake IMHO. I think you gave him to much credit for his name.
  8. Nuttypoolog Nuttypoolog is offline

    United States

    Posts: 71
    Joined: Feb 05

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 4:46pm) in reply to On The Come

    I finished in 4th place and obviously regret not calling, but I posted this as the tournament was still going on. I don't mind just calling preflop as he made a small re raise and both our stacks were deep. Funny thing was that I actually checked to him before I looked at the flop and then was put to an all in decision. I think he had QQ or JJ and I easily could have called but decided to fold and leave myself 50k rather than call and have a 50/50 shot at having a huge chip lead...I normally would have just shoved the flop w/ the three spades but since I am an idiot I checked in the dark. Anyway thanks for the responses.
     
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  9. elfman elfman is offline

    Rolling Meadows, IL
    United States

    Posts: 39
    Joined: Nov 05

    Nov 13th, 2006 (11/13/2006 8:18pm) in reply to kissamr98

    Whats the read on your villain? Is he capable of making a resteal with position or in your opinion does he very likely have a hand? Had you been raising alot preflop from early positions?

    If it looks obvious that he has a hand I would just call preflop and evaluate from there (with this flop you have to shove it all-in, imho). However if there's any chance he's capable of trying the re-steal I think you have to play right back at him preflop.

    With all that being said, his preflop raise is small enough that it seems to be crying for a call. It all depends on your read.
  10. Tim Lock Tim Lock is offline

    FL
    United States

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    Nov 14th, 2006 (11/14/2006 1:13am) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    I push this flop. I really doubt he has a set, and he'll obv call with TT-AA. But you're not in terrible shape against any of those hands (except AA). Gotta gamble it up there.

    Tim Lock
  11. notashark notashark is offline

    Phuket
    Thailand

    Posts: 1,188
    Joined: Sep 06

    Nov 14th, 2006 (11/14/2006 5:39am) in reply to Tim Lock

    push preflop....DEF push flop
     1
  12. Coreytheballer Coreytheballer is offline

    Springfield, MA
    United States

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    Joined: May 06

    Nov 14th, 2006 (11/14/2006 2:31pm) in reply to Nuttypoolog

    def all in pre....
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