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  1. <span id="lw_1261026114_1">Full Tilt Poker Game</span> #<span id="lw_1261026114_2">16864411614</span>: $10 + $1 <span id="lw_1261026114_3">Tournament</span> (125368405), Table 45 - 2000/4000 Ante 500 - No Limit Hold'em - 23:37:17 ET - 2009/12/16
    Seat 1: Apaleao (45,931)
    Seat 2: jeffthebeast (219,013)
    Seat 3: bruinsfan_33 (117,562)
    Seat 6: Outlawz78 (80,676)
    Seat 7: Redfox28 (91,897)
    Seat 8: earthruler111 (54,991)
    Apaleao antes 500
    jeffthebeast antes 500
    bruinsfan_33 antes 500
    Outlawz78 antes 500
    Redfox28 antes 500
    earthruler111 antes 500
    Outlawz78 posts the small blind of 2,000
    Redfox28 posts the big blind of 4,000
    The button is in seat #3
    *** <span id="lw_1261026114_4">HOLE CARDS</span> ***
    Dealt to bruinsfan_33 [Qd Th]
    earthruler111 folds
    Apaleao folds
    jeffthebeast folds
    bruinsfan_33 raises to 9,062
    Outlawz78 folds
    Redfox28 calls 5,062
    *** FLOP *** [6c 9h 9s]
    Redfox28 checks
    bruinsfan_33 has 15 seconds left to act
    bruinsfan_33 checks
    *** TURN *** [6c 9h 9s] [3s]
    Redfox28 checks
    bruinsfan_33 bets 12,000
    Redfox28 calls 12,000
    *** RIVER *** [6c 9h 9s 3s] [6s]
    Redfox28 bets 8,000
    bruinsfan_33 has 15 seconds left to act
    bruinsfan_33 raises to 26,000
    Redfox28 calls 18,000
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    bruinsfan_33 shows [Qd Th] two pair, Nines and Sixes
    Redfox28 shows [Td Kc] two pair, Nines and Sixes
    Redfox28 wins the pot (99,124) with two pair, Nines and Sixes
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 99,124 | Rake 0
    Board: [6c 9h 9s 3s 6s]
    Seat 1: Apaleao folded before the Flop
    Seat 2: jeffthebeast folded before the Flop
    Seat 3: bruinsfan_33 (button) showed [Qd Th] and lost with two pair, Nines and Sixes
    Seat 6: Outlawz78 (small blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 7: Redfox28 (big blind) showed [Td Kc] and won (99,124) with two pair, Nines and Sixes
    Seat 8: earthruler111 folded before the Flop
  2. LOL - Button thief! :) If you are going to open/raise trash you have to c-bet the flop.

    Have you shown down hands you opened with trash when he was at your table? Been opening to many hands? Open raising the button as a thief 3 of 5 or 4 of 5 times? He clearly put you on mostly being a button thief, maybe micro PR, mid connectors or other trash & figured his K was good.

    Do keep in mind that this one can pay off set mines.

    my 2 cents
  3. Should have set the stage a bit better. It was the FT bubble and I am 1 of 11. I am a LAG and had been raising alot of pots without much contension. I certainly think Q10 is a good enough hand to button steal with considering the situation. At showdown I hadn't really shown garbage, but only hands of solid value.The villan is passive, and I didn't think he was capable of calling a RR on the river because I was sure the small bet was a steal attempt (based on previous situations). I realize that he was getting a fairly good price there, but K10?!?!? WTF???
    Thread Starter
  4.  
    Originally Posted by mcweeder11 View Post

    ..... I am a LAG and had been raising alot of pots without much contension. .... K10?!?!? WTF???

    KT - WTF? from the one holding QT :)

    I think this tells the tail.
    *** TURN *** [6c 9h 9s] [3s]
    Redfox28 checks
    bruinsfan_33 bets 12,000
    Redfox28 calls 12,000

    After his check/call on the turn vs. LAG button thief he figured either his K is good or he's paying off a random 6. This call tells you you missed the mark on the time to change gears.
  5.  
    Originally Posted by saukendar View Post

     
    Originally Posted by mcweeder11 View Post


    ..... I am a LAG and had been raising alot of pots without much contension. .... K10?!?!? WTF???

    KT - WTF? from the one holding QT :)

    I think this tells the tail.
    *** TURN *** [6c 9h 9s] [3s]
    Redfox28 checks
    bruinsfan_33 bets 12,000
    Redfox28 calls 12,000

    After his check/call on the turn vs. LAG button thief he figured either his K is good or he's paying off a random 6. This call tells you you missed the mark on the time to change gears.

    Why couldn't I be slow playing a 9....I can understand the call on the turn and even the donk lead on the river, but when I raise him on the river he is never good with K high. (except in this case)
    Thread Starter
  6. With your LAG image you could have a 9 a 6, 33, an A-Rag or even a real hand. You can also be on a couple of paint, 87 or just air. Also "It was the FT bubble..." makes more likely you may be just a thief. Whatever you could have I'm quite sure, given that he called your raise, that he considered the river lead as value not a bluff. I also believe he decided to be calling a raise on the river bet when we check/called the turn.

    I still say you missed the mark on the time to change gears.
  7. A 9, 6, 33 or A-rag all have him beat. I find it hard to believe this bet was for value considering myself and 1 other guy punished him for his weak steal attempt on the river. Only one of these bets were called and the villan here showed bottom pair. The rest of the hands were raised after the small donk lead bets.

    You are probably right when you say I should've switched gears, but I felt like this was a great spot to pick up chips. Nobody at the table was sticking up for themselves either. Looking at his VPIP and OPR stats I think I just hand an encounter with a donkey calling station.
    Thread Starter
  8.  
    Originally Posted by mcweeder11 View Post

    I find it hard to believe this bet was for value considering myself and 1 other guy punished him for his weak steal attempt on the river. Only one of these bets were called and the villan here showed bottom pair. The rest of the hands were raised after the small donk lead bets.

    Ah - More information :)

    If he's folding steals on the river that doesn't nessarily sound like a station. If he is a station, WTF are you thinking trying to bluff him? Didn't your mama teach you to run the nutz into stations? Station or not, you do know he is willing to to call light if he "showed bottom pair". Did he win that one with bottom pair? If he's calling light with winners and folding out his losers maybe he just has emaculate reads going or is on an awsome rush.

    Another thing is if a couple of you are picking on him, he will get tired of that at some point and make a stand.

    Not sure about the other table but you started the hand second in chips & he was 3rd. I prefer to pick on shorter stacks that may be trying to move up a couple of places, the pickings just seem to be better most of the time.

    Yes "A 9, 6, 33 or A-rag all have him beat." that was my point, he knows you could have him beat..... You a can also be on a draw som paint or air . You are a LAG button thief after all :)

    Back to my original post - "Do keep in mind that this one can pay off set mines." With deep stacks be a bit more willing to see and fold flops with hands that have potential but need big implied when you hit to be EV+......... You know he is willing to pay you off.
  9.  
    Originally Posted by saukendar View Post


    Ah - More information :)

    If he's folding steals on the river that doesn't nessarily sound like a station. If he is a station, WTF are you thinking trying to bluff him? Didn't your mama teach you to run the nutz into stations? Station or not, you do know he is willing to to call light if he "showed bottom pair". Did he win that one with bottom pair? If he's calling light with winners and folding out his losers maybe he just has emaculate reads going or is on an awsome rush.

    Another thing is if a couple of you are picking on him, he will get tired of that at some point and make a stand.

    Not sure about the other table but you started the hand second in chips & he was 3rd. I prefer to pick on shorter stacks that may be trying to move up a couple of places, the pickings just seem to be better most of the time.

    I wasn't singling him out...I was being aggressive toward the whole table.

    Yes "A 9, 6, 33 or A-rag all have him beat." that was my point, he knows you could have him beat..... You a can also be on a draw som paint or air . You are a LAG button thief after all :)

    Back to my original post - "Do keep in mind that this one can pay off set mines." With deep stacks be a bit more willing to see and fold flops with hands that have potential but need big implied when you hit to be EV+......... You know he is willing to pay you off.

    I know I should be bluffing stations, but I just felt the urge in this spot. I obviously regret it now, but I didn't fully realize he was that big of a station until this.

    Sorry this wasn't clear.... you do know he is willing to to call light if he "showed bottom pair". Did he win that one with bottom pair? He was the won called and showed BP and the loosing hand.

    I prefer to pick on shorter stacks that may be trying to move up a couple of places, the pickings just seem to be better most of the time.


    I agree 100%^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    Thread Starter
  10.  
    Originally Posted by mcweeder11 View Post

    I wasn't singling him out...I was being aggressive toward the whole table.

    I just assumed when you said "myself and 1 other guy punished him for his weak steal attempt on the river." ... that a couple of you where picking on him several times over the last few orbits. That kind of thing will wear on some players and they will just play back at you. Thats not really a bad thing - just something to note about their play.
  11. Thank you for the responses. I appreciate it.
    Thread Starter
  12. Interesting hand and interesting call by villain, but...

    You already admitted you are lag-tard. Personally, as played, I really don't think his river call is that terrible.

    You raise button, ok fine. He should probably fold KT, but whatever. Flop is pretty much non-threatening and if you wanted to take it down, this would be the time. Sure, you could have flopped a monster with 66 or you hold a 9, but trips? really? I wouldn't put you on trips. Your flop check behind tells me two things: You don't have a pp which you would bet 100% of the time here. And, you probably don't have an ace, which again you would bet most of the time.

    On the turn, you make a delayed continuation bet when a 3 comes off? That 3 hit you? Really? Again, I might put you on two high cards, but I certainly wouldn't think you had a monster hand. KT really should probably fold here anyway, but I guess he's decided to make a stand against you running him over.

    River 6. Well, pretty unlikely you have a 6 since you would have bet flop. Even if somehow you had a 3, it's no good any more. Two pair with K kicker isn't half bad, unless he's up against an ace or a pp higher than 6. But, you probably don't have that either.

    I think he makes a blocking bet here on the river with what he believes to be the best hand, but then you raise and give him a decent price to call. What raises here? Pretty much only a 9 or a 6 and maybe not even a 6. A high is definitely not raising here. So, you either have a monster hand like quad 6's or 9's full which is possible considering the betting, but unlikely considering you are heads up and just happened to run into a guy that flopped that huge? Or, you are bluffing because only 9's full or quads raises here.

    Based on the way the hand played out and the cheap price on the river, I'm not surprised by the call.

    However, a river shove would probably get him to fold. I don't think he can call for all his chips with K high. Fact is, if he makes this hero call on your actual bet, he still has chips to recover or final table.

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