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agriffrod
2010 WSOP #3 FT
Posts: 7,044
Joined: Dec 05Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 11:57am) in reply to THE KING65
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agriffrod
2010 WSOP #3 FT
Posts: 7,044
Joined: Dec 05Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 12:00pm) in reply to Zpaceman
When you open raise you arent 100% of the time getting repopped, you're overestimating their range even if they are very aggressive. What happens when you would normally fold when say SB comes over top and BB comes over top of him? You stack off. SB has JJ but lets say BB has AA, you lose all your stack instead of maybe 2.5-3 BBs. Also you might just be flat called, I highly doubt you will always be repopped, they're both very deep. When you raise and you're repopped, you have the equity to be calling which makes raising and calling much better than shoving.
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Posts: 273
Joined: Nov 05Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 12:08pm) in reply to THE KING65
LOL @ overplaying small pps.
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Posts: 417
Joined: Jun 06Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 3:02pm) in reply to Annette_15
With 50x you will not have appropriate odds to call a reraise oop with small pps. If you make a standard 3x raise, the repop will likely be to 9x. You now have to put in 9/50 of your stack on what is basically a set mine. This is a classic cash game mistake.
edit: I can see the argument for this play in a tournament, though, after further thought. The call of the reraise is only 6/47 of your stack and the chance of picking up the blinds and image building might make this worth it. That, combined with the fact that you may have to take a few more chances in tournaments with 50bbs than a cash game with 50bbs as it is a race for chips makes sense, too. I just think at EXACTLY 50bbs, the play is marginal and I would limp. As the stack gets bigger, either play makes sense. -
Posts: 417
Joined: Jun 06Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 3:05pm) in reply to Zpaceman
If they have been exploiting it, you have your answer!! Make a standard raise and if they shove, auto call. If they are reraising light, you are ahead of their range and have a good double up chance, right?
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Posts: 24
Joined: Mar 07Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 3:24pm) in reply to Annette_15
Thank you Annette. This is good stuff. I just want clarification about the x unit size? I am assume x is equivalent to the size of the big-blind, correct?
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apestyles
Moderator
Posts: 5,087
Joined: Sep 05Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 6:15pm) in reply to THE KING65
Actually king has a point. Both action jeff and daut muck small pairs in ep with 25 bbs..
apestyles is an instructor at PocketFives Training . To get more of his advice and to watch his training videos, click here.
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agriffrod
2010 WSOP #3 FT
Posts: 7,044
Joined: Dec 05Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 7:04pm) in reply to THE KING65
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Posts: 250
Joined: Oct 06Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 7:23pm) in reply to Annette_15
this girls a donkey.............
she'll never get anywhereplaying like that
dicko ; ) -
Posts: 533
Joined: Nov 06Aug 19th, 2007 (8/19/2007 11:04pm) in reply to Annette_15
Great post Annette =) These are the same exact ranges I use... Logically, I would think you're probably right about adjusting your range when the antes come in although I don't think it would be a mistake to fold 22-77 even with antes and you have exactly 10 BBs or more.
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Posts: 1,353
Joined: Mar 05Aug 20th, 2007 (8/20/2007 1:50am) in reply to Zpaceman
why open shove here if u can raise and get the other person to put their money in bad w/ hands like A7etc? If they're repopping as light as u say that's a great reason to try and get money in here as often as u can.
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Great post, I finally got around to reading it, thanks Annette.
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Posts: 6,869
Joined: Apr 05Aug 20th, 2007 (8/20/2007 1:22pm) in reply to Annette_15
Final table 10r ugg.
pokerstars Game #11564852955: Tournament #57909177, $10+$1 Hold'em No Limit - Level XXVII (30000/60000) - 2007/08/18 - 23:19:55 (ET)
Table '57909177 149' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: TADELE (878724 in chips)
Seat 2: lll Euge lll (1149576 in chips)
Seat 3: beck_AA (580804 in chips)
Seat 4: KTHuge (356296 in chips)
Seat 5: Winnum1 (3533756 in chips)
Seat 6: Jack091034 (943966 in chips)
Seat 7: MonkeyCowboy (279624 in chips)
Seat 8: sominona (680200 in chips)
Seat 9: PLUNDERGUY (621554 in chips)
TADELE: posts the ante 6000
lll Euge lll: posts the ante 6000
beck_AA: posts the ante 6000
KTHuge: posts the ante 6000
Winnum1: posts the ante 6000
Jack091034: posts the ante 6000
MonkeyCowboy: posts the ante 6000
sominona: posts the ante 6000
PLUNDERGUY: posts the ante 6000
beck_AA: posts small blind 30000
KTHuge: posts big blind 60000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to MonkeyCowboy [7h 7c]
Winnum1: folds
Jack091034: folds
MonkeyCowboy: raises 213624 to 273624 and is all-in
sominona: folds
PLUNDERGUY: folds
TADELE: calls 273624
lll Euge lll: folds
beck_AA: folds
KTHuge: folds
*** FLOP *** [Jd Qc 6c]
*** TURN *** [Jd Qc 6c] [5c]
*** RIVER *** [Jd Qc 6c 5c] [Tc]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
MonkeyCowboy: shows [7h 7c] (a flush, Queen high)
TADELE: shows [Ah Ac] (a flush, Ace high)
beck_AA said, "gg cow"
TADELE collected 691248 from pot
Winnum1 said, "nh tadele"
sominona said, "GG"
TADELE said, "gg"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 691248 | Rake 0
Board [Jd Qc 6c 5c Tc]
Seat 1: TADELE showed [Ah Ac] and won (691248) with a flush, Ace high
Seat 2: lll Euge lll (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: beck_AA (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: KTHuge (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Winnum1 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Jack091034 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: MonkeyCowboy showed [7h 7c] and lost with a flush, Queen high
Seat 8: sominona folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: PLUNDERGUY folded before Flop (didn't bet) -
Posts: 19
Joined: Jan 06Aug 20th, 2007 (8/20/2007 1:51pm) in reply to Annette_15
Annette,
Thanks for the list.
Do you have the same kind of rules for unpaired hands.
Can you share some ranges of hands? -
Posts: 188
Joined: Apr 06Aug 20th, 2007 (8/20/2007 2:30pm) in reply to Annette_15
yeah this is actually a great chart. im going to use it in the future. i've definately been overshoving lately with small pp's and i need to change my game accordingly in order to go deeper in tournies. thank you annette.
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Posts: 8
Joined: Aug 07Aug 21st, 2007 (8/21/2007 10:03am) in reply to Annette_15
First of all, who the heck is Annette to give this elaborate post? Secondly, so according to you Annette, with the blinds at 500/1000 and I have 9000, I am suppose to push with 22. Correct?
lol...good way to get bounced. If I have 9x the BB, I'm not pushin with 22. I would have to be on the button with no previous raises to push all in with 22. -
oh, she's just a nobody...
<table border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0" width="231"><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#eeeedd">PocketFives.com scouting report</td></tr><tr><td>A teenage poker phenom from norway, Annette was one of the most talked about players in the second half of 2006. She's got multiple wins in the $100 rebuys on stars, and is one of a few players to have held the number 1 ranking.</td></tr></tbody></table> -
Posts: 345
Joined: Jul 05Aug 21st, 2007 (8/21/2007 11:54am) in reply to Annette_15
FWIW I think you are off on the end of your ranges (the last two tiers) and a few more could be tweaked
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^^^if that is the case, then why don't you elaborate and post what you would change.
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Posts: 307
Joined: Jul 05Aug 21st, 2007 (8/21/2007 5:43pm) in reply to bozknows2
^^^^^^^^^^^Hey bozknows2, in your profile it says "Why aren't my scores listed?" Check out Annette's on your own. Then hop on your donkey and ride off ;)
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Posts: 208
Joined: Jul 07Aug 22nd, 2007 (8/22/2007 6:43am) in reply to jesterwords
Hey Annette,
Just wanted to chime in and say thank you. It's generous for a top pro like you to share this kind of information with players like me that aspire to emulate your success. It's greatly appreciated.
tcmeb
PS. Thanks to apestyles too for contributing his thoughts. -
Great post, Thanks!
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Posts: 3
Joined: Aug 07Aug 22nd, 2007 (8/22/2007 3:18pm) in reply to Annette_15
50bb: looks good
25bb: you really raise 22 utg? looks quite bad
20-25bb: looks ok
15-20bb: ok
12-14bb: 88 is an open fold. its a -EV open push so i highly doubt that raising and calling a shove is better. 99 is closer
10-11bb: 88 is very close. vs any reasonable ranges (and many non reasonable ranges) its a -EV push. 99 is needed
9bb: pushing 55 here is -EV against standard ranges. its not very -EV but its certainly not going to be good. same with 66. 77 is a push
8bb: 22 is close but id pitch it. 44 or 55 does better
im just assuming cEV in these. being utg and likely loosing 1bb from our stack next hand is also something to consider. but a lot of these pushes are quite marginal -
Posts: 479
Joined: Jul 07Aug 22nd, 2007 (8/22/2007 8:32pm) in reply to agriffrod
"You're in the same shape with 55 v AK as you are with QQ."
Not exactly correct. Pocket 10's J's, and Q's are all 57% favorites over AK (somewhat better than a coinflip), for two reasons.
1. When the AK pairs his hand, the pocket pair will also pick up a straight draw a small percentage of the time.
2. It's a bit harder for AK to make a straight against these hands, because 2 of his outs are gone. And if he makes the straight, occasionally it'll be no good when the pocket pair fills up.
These are small edges, but they shouldn't be overlooked. -
Posts: 208
Joined: May 07Aug 23rd, 2007 (8/23/2007 5:21am) in reply to Annette_15
Annette could you do me the favor and make that list for evevry hand in every position that would be great thanks
ps thanks again for the post was a lot of help...
pss seriously though (every hand every position) -
how is this post still up here
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