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I admit it, I need a lot of help...

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  1. shady1128 shady1128 is offline

    Buffalo, NY
    United States

    Posts: 602
    Joined: Aug 07

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 7:32am)

    Guys I've basically come to a simple conclusion. I am the worst 30BB tournament player in the history of no limit hold'em tournaments. I believe I am pretty lethal when I'm playing deep (100bb's+), and I know how to effectively play a short stack, but I keep getting deep in tournaments (63 get paid, 45 left--27 get paid, 15 left etc.) and have the blinds catch up to me. When this happens and I'm sitting on a 30bb stack the following things happen...

    1.) I keep getting pushed around because either
    a.) i try stealing the blinds and constantly get re-raised all-in
    b.) i try seeing flops in position and get check-raised all-in when checked to on a missed flop
    c.) i flop around like a fish because I'm terrible

    2.) I take my finger off the trigger because of stack sizes in the blinds. Example: I want to raise 2.5x BB to take the blinds down, but there's a guy with 9 bb's in the BB and I don't want to call an all in.

    3.) I go absolutely freakin' card dead and can't defend myself at all.

    4.) I get chipped down to 15-20BB's, try to re-shove with AJ pre-flop and get called and knocked out by KQ on a KQK flop.

    I remember reading one of Phil Gordon's books a long long time ago and he said that at 30 bb's you should feel comfortable in a no limit hold'em tournament. Why am I shitting the bed in these spots?

    What I'm looking for: Any advice on how to play at this stage in a tournament. I remember reading a post on here from someone saying you should value your tournament life less late in a tournament and more earlier, maybe this is my problem? I should be opening my range of getting it in when obviously everyone's not pushing me around with AA every hand. Let me know what you think.
  2. elusively elusively is offline

    MD
    United States

    Posts: 5,260
    Joined: Feb 07

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 10:15am) in reply to shady1128

    I actually have the same problem and would love to hear some peoples comments on this.
  3. cassettecounty cassettecounty is offline

    Orlando, FL
    United States

    Posts: 716
    Joined: May 08

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 11:28am) in reply to shady1128

    I'm certainly no expert and am also looking forward to hearing other responses.

    Here are my thoughts on a few things you listed:

    2. Be more willing to pull this trigger the closer to the money you are. A short stack in the blinds at that point is just aching to make the money and won't get involved unless he's got a big hand. Far from the money when the short stack's shove still has fold equity, don't raise from a position where it looks like a steal unless you've got a big hand yourself and can consider calling an all-in.

    3. This took me a long time to get over. Finally I started telling myself "the other people at this table have no idea I'm card dead." Don't play your cards. You'll often have to play shit hands like big hands or you will be blinded off.

    4. This is just UL. You needed to double up so you had to gamble. You got in with the best of it and lost. That's going to happen. Can't look at results.
  4. Chickenbrad Chickenbrad is offline

    Bend, OR
    United States

    Posts: 360
    Joined: Jan 09

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 12:59pm) in reply to cassettecounty

    Sounds like you're complaining about running bad...

    30bbs depends a lot on the other stack sizes at your table and the way the table is playing. Simple advice would be:

    1)play tighter in EP this deep
    2)Pay attention to the effective stacks that are yet to act behind you. I.E. Don't raise a hand that on the button if the BB has a shove stack and you know you can't call.

    Obv. a lot more to it than this, but something to think about.
  5. shady1128 shady1128 is offline

    Buffalo, NY
    United States

    Posts: 602
    Joined: Aug 07

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 2:10pm) in reply to shady1128

    Thanks for the replies guys. Yeah I did manage to stick a little bitch about running bad in there so for future responses you can disregard that part. This is my biggest leak by far. I find myself constantly trying to apply pressure and seeing it backfire in my face. These decisions are literally the difference between me being a winning player in MTT's and being the loser that I am. Although, that being said one deep cash in one of these tournaments and I'd be a winner again haha. I'm just so sick of these 15th's, or 20ths.

    I agree with ChickenBrad's point of playing tight in EP and I do, but the problem is my raises from LP don't get much respect. Idk, possibly that's because during the middle stages of the tournament I'm stealing ALOT from LP. But I then feel like if I tighten up TOO much I'm just sitting there and can't make a move.

    Any other thoughts?
    Thread Starter
  6. 13Jayhawk13 13Jayhawk13 is offline

    Olathe, KS
    United States

    Posts: 761
    Joined: Feb 08

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 2:20pm) in reply to shady1128

    With respect to 1.a., always remember to look at the stack sizes of those behind you. For example, you have 30 bb and raise to 3x (you have 27bb behind). If for example the blinds have 15 - 22bb, they are going to be in a great position to resteal and you will really only be able to call with the top 15% of your range (or better).

    That is why stealing is overrated at this point, because your opponents will typically all have shove or restealing stacks (8-20bb). If that is the case, I think you really need to play your stack as if you have a resteal stack yourself. This means you can't steal the blinds, you must be looking to 3bet your opponents for all their chips and if you are going to open raise, you can only do this with hands that you will be willing to call your opponents 3bet shoves with.

    I think if you can plug this leak of your desire to steal in these spots in the tourney, you will find yourself having a lot more success.

    Hope this helps.

    Jayhawk
  7. cassettecounty cassettecounty is offline

    Orlando, FL
    United States

    Posts: 716
    Joined: May 08

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 2:29pm) in reply to shady1128

    If you're always raising from hijack-button seats, people are going to pick up on that and you'll stop getting respect.

    Mix it up. Just because you're button doesn't mean you HAVE to raise a limped or folded pot every time with any two cards. Fold horrible holdings here every once in awhile to keep from getting too predictable, otherwise every raise you make from LP will look like a steal, which only benefits you if you wake up with a monster at some point (i.e., not very often).

    Your LP raises will get more respect if people perceive you to be a relatively tight player and not one who plays position every time he has it.
  8. shady1128 shady1128 is offline

    Buffalo, NY
    United States

    Posts: 602
    Joined: Aug 07

    Apr 8th, 2009 (4/8/2009 3:31pm) in reply to shady1128

    I really like what Jayhawk has to say here. Definitely something I'm going to keep in mind. Rather then constantly putting myself out there to get shoved around I can put myself in a position to either a.) do the shoving or b.) be able to call a raise. Cassette, obv I'm not playing atc in position, but definitely hands like K10s, J9s etc. However these aren't hands I want to be calling shoves with all the time. Thanks alot for the advice guys. I think this will definitely help me out.
    Thread Starter
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