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interesting hand form live game 2/5 nl last night.. thoughts??

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  1. iloveparis iloveparis is offline

    Saint Paul, MN
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 1:46pm)

    I would like to get some thoughts on a hand from 2/5nl I played last night.

    This table was very weak as it always is at this casino so I try to get involved in many hands because the post flop play is so bad. I have only ben playing the table for about 45 minutues and am sitting with about $1400 ( up $900 )

    So UTG I get Qd 8d I raise to $20
    ,
    Player 1: I have never played with before. seems some what tight, average player but has overplayed a few hands so far.

    Player 2: I have played with 3 or 4 times. A total Donk, known to call $300 on gut shots, pays off everything, a big time losing player....etc......

    player 1 and 2 and big blind call......

    pot $82

    flop 10d 9d 4s

    I make a continuation bet of $50 just hoping to take the pot down right there. Player 1 and 2 call and BB folds....

    pot now $232

    turn 10d 9d 4s Js

    very interesting board with so many draws and so much going on. I have a straight with a flush draw, and str8 flush draw.

    I check... player 1 bets $110... player 2 raises to $300... both players are sitting with about $500-$600 left behind them.......

    The action comes to me..... what do I do???????

    Thoughts??????

    I will explain the rest of the hand later.

    iloveparis
  2. sickdickey sickdickey is offline

    Hollywood, CA
    United States

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 1:50pm) in reply to iloveparis

    if you don't shove i laugh at you.
    You have the made straight with a redraw to a better hand and a draw to an unbeatable hand.

    Sometimes you lose to K Q straight, but such is life.
    what happens if you miss flush on river, are you folding to a push?
    What happens if spade comes on river? are you folding thinking a flush has you beat?

    Just get the money in.
    My guess is you shoved, were behind to K Q, and hit your flush.
     
  3. d2themfi d2themfi is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 1:53pm) in reply to iloveparis

    yeah just shove. Player 2 could have the KQ, but you have redraw outs agianst that, plus his range is wide enough that you could have the best hand. I mean he could have a bigger flush draw, a set, or maybe top two

    Edit: it also depends on the stacks, if both players started with 100bb stacks then shove, if not, it would depend how deepm they are
     
  4. darkcheck_ darkcheck_ is offline

    Costa Rica

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 1:56pm) in reply to iloveparis

    plz dont say you tried to do something hero-esque and fold here
     
  5. Rocket Surgeon Rocket Surgeon is offline & brain scientist

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 2:05pm) in reply to iloveparis

    If you go by your reads, then I don't believe a tight player (player 1) is calling a 3/4 pot bet with QK on that flop.

    Additionally, if you go by you reads, no wayyyyyyyyyy in hell you can ever put a completely horrible player on the one single hand that beats you. If he has it, then his image earned him a huge pot.... but making a super super tight fold with 2nd nuts against a complete donkey is terrible.

    My guess is that if your reads are on, then player 1 either has 2 pr or a set, and player 2 could have anything, maybe a flush draw, straight draw? Although I'm sure you are going to say someone had KQ.

    I can't imagine calling being a good play here, and I also can't ever see a reason against those 2 players to fold. This is a shove, 100%.
  6. yogiblair yogiblair is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 2:08pm) in reply to Rocket Surgeon

    I second everything Brianyut said and SHOVE 100%
  7. MSU-ATO MSU-ATO is offline

    Morganfield, KY
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 2:44pm) in reply to yogiblair

    I say player one has 10J, and player two has 78 or possibly KQ since you made the point to say he will call big bets on a gutshot, but I cant see a reason to do anything besides either raise to 700$ or push depending on their stack sizes. I guess you could flat call the 300 and try and string along player one but there is enough money in the pot to get it in. Push all day everyday.........
  8. paulpete paulpete is offline

    Las Vegas, NV
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 2:45pm) in reply to iloveparis

    taco bell
  9. AceRunner AceRunner is offline

    Thailand

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 3:15pm) in reply to paulpete

    SHOVE!
  10. Willywoo Willywoo is offline

    Colorado Springs, CO
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 3:29pm) in reply to AceRunner

    The answer to your question seems obvious. My question is why, if you are playing with a bunch of donks, are you raising utg with Q8s?

    This not a criticism it is a question.
  11. adam_mc adam_mc is offline

    Ottawa
    Canada

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:07pm) in reply to Willywoo

    This is not an interesting hand. Put your money in the middle.
  12. iloveparis iloveparis is offline

    Saint Paul, MN
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:10pm) in reply to Willywoo

    thanks for all the interesting responses......

    Willy like I explained before the game was/is so weak I like to play alot of hands and outplay people after the flop. I had won like $1500 on the 1/2 nl game in about 4.5 hours prior to getting to the 2/5 nl so I was playing extra aggresive going for a big win on the night.

    Like most of you I felt the move here was to push all in... The thought ran threw my head that either player could have kq but if they did I had outs. I thought about calling and seeing the river but I pushed all in...

    Player 1 stood up in agony and thought for a good 5 minutes you could see the pain in his face with the tough choice he had to make.... after about 5 minutes he calls...... player 2 then insta calls.....

    the river brings a 10 of hearts...

    what did player 1 and 2 have and did I win the pot?

    iloveparis
    Thread Starter
  13. shnookiestyle shnookiestyle is offline

    Minneapolis, MN
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:14pm) in reply to Willywoo

    another question why are you checking the turn?
     
  14. moscow01 moscow01 is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:16pm) in reply to iloveparis

    Player 1 had ace jack of diamonds, player 2 had 78 of spades.
    River brings the duece of diamonds and player 1 takes his t shirt off, waves it around his head screaming ' Thats poker baby!, woooooo' He then proceeds to hit and run, spending his winnings on a wide variety of pornographic material.
    GG
  15. Rollerman Rollerman is offline

    Somerset, WI
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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:33pm) in reply to moscow01

    I assume u were ther for bounty tournament. How did u do in that?
  16. DUBZX DUBZX is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:36pm) in reply to iloveparis

    99 obv owned u and hte other dude had 78 and u feel like killin him

    was gunna say j10 butttttt i forgot set of 9s always hit
  17. Nova2000 Nova2000 is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 6:45pm) in reply to iloveparis

    I'd be shocked as hell if you didn't lose this one...

    When I read your first post I thought JT for Player 1...Player 2 I honestly have no clue what the hell this guy has with your description...Maybe T9 for player 2, but that would make it the case 10...
  18. mets22 mets22 is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 7:02pm) in reply to iloveparis

    10 4 off
  19. dtylerfritz dtylerfritz is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 7:18pm) in reply to iloveparis

    Very interesting hand.
    if ur read is right and u strongely belive u have the best hand u could smooth call the turn bet hoping to drag along player 1. Then make a smallish value bet on the river hoping to get called by both players. if u shove there is a chance both players will fold. we sit a long time at a poker table for a hand like this. I think u should try and extract the most money possible from both player.

    I think it is possible for either player to have KQ here. Many players are capable of splashing around here with two overs and a gut shot.
  20. Mayhem 31337 Mayhem 31337 is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 7:33pm) in reply to iloveparis

    the suspense is killing me.
  21. moe86 moe86 is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 7:47pm) in reply to Mayhem 31337

    u probably lost my guess is if you won this hand u wouldn't have posted...alright good talk
     
  22. DJ_Chaps DJ_Chaps is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 8:04pm) in reply to moe86

    <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" bgColor=#ffffff border=0><TBODY><TR bgColor=#eeeedd><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> </TD><TD>Re(1): interesting hand form live game 2/5 nl last night.. thoughts??
    by dtylerfritz on 6/10/2007 18:18 </TD><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><NOBR> </NOBR></TD><TD><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD></TD><TD> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR bgColor=#ffffff><TD bgColor=#ffffff></TD><TD colSpan=2><TABLE cellPadding=2 border=0 celspacing="0"><TBODY><TR><TD>Very interesting hand.
    if ur read is right and u strongely belive u have the best hand u could smooth call the turn bet hoping to drag along player 1. Then make a smallish value bet on the river hoping to get called by both players. if u shove there is a chance both players will fold. we sit a long time at a poker table for a hand like this. I think u should try and extract the most money possible from both player.

    I think it is possible for either player to have KQ here. Many players are capable of splashing around here with two overs and a gut shot. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    Yes, because you want to invite those draws to see the river and cripple ur nuts, for as cheaply as possible? ok.
  23. supermoves supermoves is offline invented poker

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 8:42pm) in reply to iloveparis

    Hey Donovan, good to see you around again! Im thinking about going against the crowd here. If you push, you make hands that you beat fold...like TPTK, maybe even two pair. At the same time, youre saying that these guys will call with draws no matter what. SO if you move in, hands you crush are folding and draws that can beat you are calling.

    Now, if you are prepared to let lose a big pot by getting all the money in when you are sure the draws are going to call anyway, why not check/call. It would seem to me that check/calling would give the worst hand a chance to bluff you, by the same token, if the draw DOES come in, you might have a chance to get away. Now, this is not something I advocate frequently, this is a special situation. If there was ANY chance your opponants would fold draws, then pushing would be the right move, but youre saying these tools will call $300 on a gutshot, so they are not folding a flush draw.

    That being said, you pushed, got the one caller and the T gave him the boat for his trip 9s?
    1
  24. ihaterats ihaterats is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 8:44pm) in reply to supermoves

    More importantly, was the game catered by Taco Bell?
  25. EaglesPwn EaglesPwn is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 9:26pm) in reply to iloveparis

    I def shove there I mean what could they have?
    I would figure one has a flush draw and the other maybe trips? I didnt scroll down yet to see if you gave the result yet....will look now.
  26. EaglesPwn EaglesPwn is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 9:29pm) in reply to iloveparis

    what happened,paris? Im thinking you won the pot...1 player had trip 4s and the other had a flush draw.
  27. paulpete paulpete is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 9:41pm) in reply to EaglesPwn

    i havent seen this much suspense in a thread since that taco bell thread in OT awhile ago.............
  28. dtylerfritz dtylerfritz is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 10:44pm) in reply to DJ_Chaps

    well if u are confident that u have the best hand w/a str8 u would be about 65% to win the pot even against 2 other players.
    i belive it is worth it to string the players along trying to extract the most money possible
  29. turnip_juice turnip_juice is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 10:57pm) in reply to iloveparis

  30. turnip_juice turnip_juice is offline

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    Jun 10th, 2007 (6/10/2007 11:00pm) in reply to iloveparis

    guy that folded had j -10 and the guy that called your all in had pocket 4's filled up on river and u lost but recovred well and ended $5000 ahead after you stopped raising q-8 utg. I know you said you could outplay them after the flop but wouldn;t it be more profitable to play qaulity hands and make your decisions easier if you want to make money??
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