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just do a check on heads up 4 man sit n gos and go wow, collude much?

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  1. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:21am)

    MORAN23 & maxv2

    maxv2 is searchable but moran23 is not.

    plaing in 115 4 man winner take all sit n gos.

    i've watch them play in atleast 4 already. both from orono

    regardless if they are not trying to cheat, they obviously do know each other and are entering 4 man winner take all sit n gos.

    pretty disgusting how much this goes on at stars.
  2. leakinmoney leakinmoney is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:25am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    n how is this cheating????
     
  3. sandler1860 sandler1860 is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:26am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    -is not cheating

    -happens a lot

    -stars is ok with it

    -again...not cheating in any way
     
  4. epicatc epicatc is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:27am) in reply to leakinmoney

    Unless Im seriously mistaken, all sites have already said that there is no such thing as collusion in 4-player HU SNGs. Several top players have admitted to doing this, and the sites signed off on it. Unless those weren't winner-take-all, this issue was put to bed a long time ago.
  5. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:28am) in reply to sandler1860

    yea i figured it wouldn't be cheating, even if they are splitting the money.

    standard

    what do i know.
    Thread Starter
  6. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:29am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    close thread please.
    Thread Starter
  7. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:36am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    i dont know how to get hand history but i just watch one guy shove 6's all in pre and the other call with 37 suited like 3k in chips as soon as they both reached the final table.

    lol @ this is not cheating ok guys. just cause some pros do it does not mean that this is not a way to cheat and that people aren't doing it, like i just witnessed.
    Thread Starter
  8. leakinmoney leakinmoney is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:39am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    think it thru n when it finally clicks u can come back and apologize
     
  9. heavyj80 heavyj80 is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:39am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    guy was obv born on march 7th and always rolls with his favorite hand. plus it was suited.

    keep sportin that tin foil hat though.
  10. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:45am) in reply to heavyj80

    pretty funny how those defending this obviously do it.

    i don't need to think about it. when i see them both make the ft and go all in 1st hand with w/e, common sense says that is pretty shady. regardless if each beat out 2 other random non colluding players to get to the final table.

    keep thinking what you're doing is right, cause stars says it is ok, and "regular pros do it."

    also get some morals while you're down in your pit.
    Thread Starter
  11. leakinmoney leakinmoney is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:47am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    lmao i dont play 4 mans but tell me how this hurts the other players involved
     
  12. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 2:53am) in reply to leakinmoney

     
    Originally Posted by leakinmoney View Post

    lmao i dont play 4 mans but tell me how this hurts the other players involved

    it's more like player 2 players
    as long as one makes final table and ships, probably reimbursing the other and than going onto the next one.

    it's pretty shady in my honest opinion, but to each their own.

    lock thread please.
    Thread Starter
  13. PJam PJam is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:05am) in reply to epicatc

     
    Originally Posted by epicatc View Post

    Unless Im seriously mistaken, all sites have already said that there is no such thing as collusion in 4-player HU SNGs. Several top players have admitted to doing this, and the sites signed off on it. Unless those weren't winner-take-all, this issue was put to bed a long time ago.

    full tilt doesnt allow this, i use to do it on there and they told me to stop or they would ban, but they said it wasnt colluding they just dont want it going on for some reason
  14. leakinmoney leakinmoney is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:08am) in reply to PJam

    they dont want it going on bc ppl think its collusion, i cant imagine how many emails they must get about this kind of shit
     
  15. GambleAB GambleAB is offline 1. I'm awesome

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:12am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    Oh that crazy HU collusion.
     
  16. Frank1The1Tank Frank1The1Tank is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:17am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    Here's why its not colluding/cheating/scamming/effecting anyone/etc.

    4 Players in this HU winner take all.

    Player A and B are the ones that are friends, C and D are randos.

    Scenario 1. A plays C, wins. B plays D, wins. C and D both had a fair match and lost, A and B can do what they want.

    Scenario 2. A plays B, wins. C plays D, wins. Again C and D both had a fair match, C now plays A and loses, again C had a fair match.

    Any other scenario will have the same result, and either way you look at it, nobody is being cheated. It would be just like 2 random regs playing in the same ones frequently with 2 randoms. If the 2 regs have a neutral EV vs each other than in the long run their win rates will be the same, and the loss rates of the randoms will be the same whether the regs work with each other or not. So again, there is no wrong doing being done other than variance being reduced for the regs working with each other. Thanks and gl.
     
  17. Half.The.Man Half.The.Man is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:20am) in reply to Frank1The1Tank

    ty frank for explaining it
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  18. cleptophobe cleptophobe is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 3:58am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    lol its not an algebra problem. stop trying to be detective and stwu.
  19. rivverkiller rivverkiller is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 4:04am) in reply to GambleAB

     
    Originally Posted by GambleAB View Post

    Oh that crazy HU collusion.

     
  20. Gags30 Gags30 is online now

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 7:43am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    is it me, or do op's responses seem kind of bipolar
    170 2 

    Gags30 is an instructor at PocketFives Training . To get more of his advice and to watch his training videos, click here.

  21. Vekked Vekked is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 10:00am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    plz plz plz be a level
     1
  22. I Spew Chips I Spew Chips is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 10:18am) in reply to Vekked

    repost

    and i love how op repeats himself 14 times before he even thinks about how it works...and then understands it when someone else explains it lol
     
  23. EyeKnows EyeKnows is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 10:33am) in reply to Half.The.Man

    The horror...
  24. Bong BrOke Bong BrOke is offline need new bong

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 11:03am) in reply to EyeKnows

    loooooooooool @ OP
  25. vitobiggs vitobiggs is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 11:05am) in reply to Gags30

     
    Originally Posted by Gags30 View Post

    is it me, or do op's responses seem kind of bipolar

     1
  26. PardoG PardoG is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 11:10am) in reply to Bong BrOke

    you guys may be laughing at the original poster but once again, another stupid thing that goes on online, "teams" of players working together to decrease their variance, increase their longterm edge and blah blah blah, it's not cheating, its not illeagal, its just lame, weasely and another typical example of online players taking an edge wherever they can, no matter how bad it is for the game or the reputation of poker in general.....just play straight up and win, or get a real job and contribute to society
  27. PocketRuners PocketRuners is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 11:37am) in reply to vitobiggs

     
    Originally Posted by vitobiggs View Post

     
    Originally Posted by Gags30 View Post

    is it me, or do op's responses seem kind of bipolar

    Bipolar, paranoid schizophrenic, conspiracy theorist... Take your pick...
  28. rungoodmuch rungoodmuch is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 12:06pm) in reply to vitobiggs

     
    Originally Posted by vitobiggs View Post

     
    Originally Posted by Gags30 View Post

    is it me, or do op's responses seem kind of bipolar

  29. EyeKnows EyeKnows is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 1:42pm) in reply to Half.The.Man

    OK, I do see an edge for them, the "team" saves time by not playing the matches when they are against each other but this is the only edge they get, there is no direct money-edge/competitive-edge at all.
  30. Frank1The1Tank Frank1The1Tank is offline

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    Apr 14th, 2009 (4/14/2009 1:56pm) in reply to PardoG

     
    Originally Posted by PardoG View Post

    you guys may be laughing at the original poster but once again, another stupid thing that goes on online, "teams" of players working together to decrease their variance, increase their longterm edge and blah blah blah, it's not cheating, its not illeagal, its just lame, weasely and another typical example of online players taking an edge wherever they can, no matter how bad it is for the game or the reputation of poker in general.....just play straight up and win, or get a real job and contribute to society

    They aren't "increasing" their edge by working together. They are merely reducing the time it takes to complete a 4 man HU (which has no effect on the others involved). And they are reducing the amount of variance they would experience if they had to battle each other in it too. Since people who are neutral EV vs each other are still going to have upswings and downswings when they play. This just eliminates that and their variance is reduced to beating the other two in the first or 2nd match. So basically this teammwork does 2 things:
    1. Increase hourly by finishing faster and thus playing more.
    2. Decrease variance by not playing with each other and instead just splitting every time.
     
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