I know you guys are going to say this is a poker forum so we should be trying to get better, help each other out, etc because that is what you are supposed to do. I know the newer players that are still trying to learn are going to say well you guys who have been around forever always discussed hands over the internet so it is stupid for you to say we should not. I know siola is going to say lololol it doesnt matter everyone sucks anyways.

I am just so sick of seeing all these threads where some hsmtt reg posts a hand, there is some good advice and then everyone reads it and gets a little better. I mean, Little Kraut plays 400 tournaments a day and we are supposed to just help him out with a hand so he can make even more money? (not attacking little kraut here, just saw his thread today and it reminded me of something I have been wanting to post for a long time)

Obviously this post is not going to stop all you guys from posting and replying about hands, but maybe some of you will think twice about it and realize how everything adds up and gradually people are getting better from these public posts. The game is getting tougher every day and I just do not see why you guys are trying to make it even harder to earn money. If you want to talk about hands, create a private forum of a bunch of people who you respect. Be selective of who you let in. I guarantee you there will be a lot more discussion and a lot better discussion than what occurs on P5s, 2p2, etc.

ya ya ya, we want to give back to the community that helped us out so much...who cares, be selfish and look at your own bottom line. It is your occupation/hobby and helping random people to improve is just unprofessional.

lol why u picking on bobby... guy puts in work.... i dont know anybody with 200k profit with his biggest score up until last night was 13kish... big ups bobby keep putting in that volume...

and to op yeah man i can understand but if someone truly wants to learn the game... doubt poeple not posting on 5s is gonna stand in their way... u sound kind of greedy and shrewd in your op not saying that u are.. u r just coming across that way.... whos to say people seeing the posts and they read and then decide that they might deposit and take a shot... clearly ur still gonna be light years ahead.... just saying doubt giving out some advice here and there is gonna hurt much... i think the positives outweigh the negatives...

while we're at it, let's shut down poker training sites so we can conserve our edges

also need to silence norman chad on how to play JJ, people are playing it so damn perfectly these days

 

Originally Posted by random.chu

while we're at it, let's shut down poker training sites so we can conserve our edges

also need to silence norman chad on how to play JJ, people are playing it so damn perfectly these days

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and for op, u act like youve make some huge revelation and this topic has never been discussed here before

 

Originally Posted by pwnsmyself

lol why u picking on bobby... guy puts in work.... i dont know anybody with 200k profit with his biggest score up until last night was 13kish... big ups bobby keep putting in that volume...

and to op yeah man i can understand but if someone truly wants to learn the game... doubt poeple not posting on 5s is gonna stand in their way... u sound kind of greedy and shrewd in your op not saying that u are.. u r just coming across that way.... whos to say people seeing the posts and they read and then decide that they might deposit and take a shot... clearly ur still gonna be light years ahead.... just saying doubt giving out some advice here and there is gonna hurt much... i think the positives outweigh the negatives...

was not picking on bobby at all. obviously he is a sicko with the amount of volume he puts in

 

Originally Posted by random.chu

while we're at it, let's shut down poker training sites so we can conserve our edges

also need to silence norman chad on how to play JJ, people are playing it so damn perfectly these days

we cant do anything about the poker training sites. we can do something about this.

 

Originally Posted by cream420

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and for op, u act like youve make some huge revelation and this topic has never been discussed here before

lol how stupid do you think I am? of course it is not some huge revelation and of course this has been discussed before. I just felt like its a pretty important subject and people should be reminded.

I'm sorry I forgot how stupid the posters are on this site. I guess I should have expected moronic unconstructive smartass responses.

 

Originally Posted by mindtrip954

The top online pro- im not sure why they would give advice as it seems that they are on top of the game. At the same time sites like this are helpful to them as they can observe what the opponents are thinking and how the opponents are approaching the game. Im sure alot of the top pros gained alot of knowledge from sites like these as they moved up, and could be a reason why they feel the need to give back to the community. I know I appreciate it. Whatever the case im glad they dont just sit within thier top pros community and go over things with each other (altho this obv happens alot in addition to posting on sites like this)
/

Ya, exactly what I am getting at. I am not expecting the other groups of people to stop posting and trying to get better.They have everything to gain from it and nothing to lose.

I am trying to explain how these "top pros" who post advice really should stop. I am sure all these guys know they should not be doing it, but they still do it for whatever reason (ego, giving back to the community, to improve, etc) Like I said in the OP, yes they might feel the need to give back to the community, but it really is not worth it. They are "top pros". They play this game to make money and posting advice on public forums clearly is bad for their bottom line. Yes, "the learners" appreciate advice from "the top pros", but who cares? It is their job to make money. Yes, it is possible these "top pros" want to discuss hands too. Well, the solution to that is to talk over AIM, chat rooms with other legends, or create a private forum. Obviously there are private forums out there. If you are not involved in one, be proactive about it and try to start one and get other people who you respect to join. I know I would love to have a place where I can discuss stuff with a lot of people I respect without giving away info to the public. Call me selfish. I don't care. I don't think you would question people in other professions looking after their bottom line.

Pretty sure a lott of hsmtt regs and ranked players don't get involved in hand discussions on here for exactly that reason and meta game factors.

I couldn't agree with OP more. Keep online poker profitable imo!!

holla

As I stated above I feel like there is a small percentage that actually will learn from what the top guys are posting. I also think that alot of bad players will see the advice and not understand it, but still try to incorporate it in thier game. For example lets say thiers a thread where a top player feels his opponent is weak and decideds a 5 bet shove with 45os, or they pull off a huge river bluff. If alot of players start 5bet shoving small connectors, without fully understanding the reasoning why you did it, or try some ridiculous bluff or 3barrel etc, without understanding why does that not lead to more profit for the top players.

The point I am getting at is that you are helping a small percentage of the community, a percentage that is likely to move up regardless. At the same time top players are learning from each other by posting. Lastly top players are profiting everytime one of the many bad players try to emulate your play without grasping why you made the play.

I think its comparable to blackjack. When the movie 21 came out Im sure there was a huge wave of people thinking counting cards was going to be there get rich quick scheme. Altho many people likely rushed into it and had plenty of books/websites/tools to teach them how to do it, the majority fail because they dont put the time into to learn. Small miscalculations easily leads them into betting large amounts when they arent favored. Top pros are giving hand advice will lead to a few players actually improving, and a mass of people losing more money.

Just because the information is out there in a public forum doesnt mean people will benefit from it, the top pros should actually profit from the masses trying to emulate what they do, as most players wont/cant succeed at it.

i do see your point of what does a top mtt player have to gain, and if i ever got to a point where i was in that elite class im not sure i would be overly giving with hand advice. But I do think there is a case to be made that having top pros posting hand advice leads to more money coming up the food chain.

just get better brah,
I like how people all know standard lines and shit now it's easier to play against,..
I have been playing fulltime for little over 2 years now and my edge is still getting bigger but you do need to work harder.
people WILL get better just means u have to get better too, it's an ongoing process.
only thing sucks is people know how to shove unexpliodeble...so if you want to preserve ur edge start trying to get the structures on the sites better instead of this pointless topic.

Sorry but I like the replies. Probably 99% of the advice on here is pretty horrid, spewtastic, over-aggressive, and just plain bad. Makes for easy double ups in my regular games.

 

Originally Posted by ThaSquirrel

...so if you want to preserve ur edge start trying to get the structures on the sites better instead of this pointless topic.

I agree with this....the Non-turbo schedule these days is pretty laughable..

overall, moneyinbag is pretty correct with his statements imo, but :



-yes ppl play more standardish everyday, but that's not turning them necessarily into any good/fearable opponents, and that makes them even more predictable in many occasions.


-most of advanced strategy posts on a public forum got like 37 different points of view, and if you are not any good at poker yet, thats pretty easy to follow the wrong advices or to just not understand what you read exactly, etc.

I thought a big part of what this site is about is discussing strategy with other good players?? How did you get to where you are at, I dont know you but my guess would be you talked strategy with other good players on P5s or 2+2 etc, so what you get better using forums, but nobody esle should because the game is getting tougher? LOL....seems a bit hypocritical.....ask Pearljammer/ Rizen/ Apestyles why they wrote those books, they helped a lot of players improve, or Harrington, or Negraneau, etc etc.....I mean information, training sites, forums are all out there.....should you shut down all this super secret poker strategy information somehow?? No, the bottom line is a lot of people join this site to improve....can you read the posts and be one step ahead of the "standard lines" and find way to expoit them for your own profit?? Sure, go ahead.....Im pretty sure the top players are well aware of how good (but not great) players think, what lines they typically take etc etc....so I guess just stay informed on standard lines and stay ahead of the curve.....No need to try to shut down HH, strategy discussions etc, there will always be fish out there, and decent/good players, and great players....its 2010 the info is out there, for anyone that wants to improve they just have to go get it....but like most things people are lazy and dont want to put in the work to improve.....but if they do I think p5s is as good a place as any to try to improve

they wrote those books to make money fwiw and make a steady source of income; most people who do training sites and write books aren't doing it out of some sense of "good for the community" even if they say it; they want to add to their bottom line and sites/videos do that in a steady way

100% agree, have thought this for a long time.

I'm here solely for the drama threads and to donate for the last longer/biggest cash bets. Seriously.

An interesting side note. A lot of 'top' players do mentoring, so posting a few 'free' strat posts is like a form of advertisement. Just sayin'.