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MM Bubble: Shove Pre?

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  1. LittleWolf LittleWolf is offline

    Lansdale, PA
    United States

    Posts: 181
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:10am)

    Midnight Madness has been a donkey fest at this table. We're about 15 from the bubble and this hand comes up:

    Full Tilt Poker Game #10387376215: Midnight Madness! (77685006), Table 20 - 200/400 Ante 50 - No Limit Hold'em - 2:00:39 ET - 2009/02/02
    Seat 1: kuckla13 (4,781)
    Seat 2: A-Mo10 (13,841)
    Seat 3: SanDiegoTex (1,791)
    Seat 4: Avaskavich (7,985)
    Seat 5: mrfony (11,898)
    Seat 6: weedonk (6,215)
    Seat 7: GutShotJ (9,030)
    Seat 8: LittleWolf (5,865)
    Seat 9: icalleverythimg (8,492)
    kuckla13 antes 50
    A-Mo10 antes 50
    SanDiegoTex antes 50
    Avaskavich antes 50
    mrfony antes 50
    weedonk antes 50
    GutShotJ antes 50
    LittleWolf antes 50
    icalleverythimg antes 50
    icalleverythimg posts the small blind of 200
    kuckla13 posts the big blind of 400
    The button is in seat #8
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to LittleWolf [Kd Kh]
    A-Mo10 calls 400
    SanDiegoTex folds
    Avaskavich folds
    mrfony folds
    weedonk folds
    GutShotJ folds
    LittleWolf ?

    Do I shove my 14.5x BB in Pre from this position? Or do a standard 4x raise, then shove flop if no Ace comes out? I'm in a bad position obviously, and I know most of the answers are gonna lean towards playing for the win, but this close to the bubble with that short of a stack, I'd really just like to cash and go to bed.

    Results will follow in about 30 minutes. Thanks in advance
  2. AFink93 AFink93 is offline

    Norwich, CT
    United States

    Posts: 14,381
    Joined: Mar 06

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:15am) in reply to LittleWolf

    If you really just want to cash and go to bed. Shut the computer off and do so.. Shove here I think all day.
  3. LittleWolf LittleWolf is offline

    Lansdale, PA
    United States

    Posts: 181
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:23am) in reply to AFink93

     
    Originally Posted by AFink93 View Post

    If you really just want to cash and go to bed. Shut the computer off and do so.. Shove here I think all day.

    I shouldn't say I just wanted to cash and go to bed. My line of thinking was more like... "If I can dodge the ace and double through, I'll be happy and keep going at it. If not, I'd rather just get away from it, grab my $2 and go sleep"
    Thread Starter
  4. Smokin Zags Smokin Zags is offline 2010 CA Amateur Golf Champion

    Lake Forest, CA
    United States

    Posts: 1,941
    Joined: Oct 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:27am) in reply to LittleWolf

    ur options are...

    A. Raise

    <strike>B. Call</strike>

    <strike>C. Fold</strike>

    Edit: Just raising is def best at this level instead of shoving... although shoving is never bad (just not optimal in the MM)
     
  5. pikappraider78 pikappraider78 is offline

    Gainesville, FL
    United States

    Posts: 2,039
    Joined: Aug 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:29am) in reply to LittleWolf

    i alternate here between opening 2.2-2.5sish or just open shoving. mainly depends on how wide the players behind have been calling shoves. against randoms or with no info i open standard.

    and btw opening 4x at this level is not good, no reason to open that big

    i just read the part about just cashing and going to bed..... why play the tournament if you just want to play for 3-4 hours and make 2 dollars
     
  6. LittleWolf LittleWolf is offline

    Lansdale, PA
    United States

    Posts: 181
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:38am) in reply to pikappraider78

    PiKap: It's been loosish... BB's been a huge fish looking to stack off and make huge plays with junk hands. UTG hasn't been abusing the bubble but he's been calling a little light with A6+, especially on the short stacks.

    And I agree, I wasn't out to "bubble in and sleep" when I joined the tournament, I was playing for the win. I had done fairly well early, getting my stack up to just under 10k before the first break, only to come back and lose a large hunk of it on the first hand afterwards. I pretty much went card dead until we hit the bubble and my interest just wasn't there any more (I'm sure I can do a whole other thread on that lol). At the point of the tournament, I just didn't want to lose on the bubble (scared bubble play maybe, I'll post results in a second) to one of them light calling with Ax if I open shoved.
    Thread Starter
  7. LittleWolf LittleWolf is offline

    Lansdale, PA
    United States

    Posts: 181
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 1:41am) in reply to LittleWolf

    Well it's been 30 minutes, results!

    Full Tilt Poker Game #10387376215: Midnight Madness! (77685006), Table 20 - 200/400 Ante 50 - No Limit Hold'em - 2:00:39 ET - 2009/02/02
    Seat 1: kuckla13 (4,781)
    Seat 2: A-Mo10 (13,841)
    Seat 3: SanDiegoTex (1,791)
    Seat 4: Avaskavich (7,985)
    Seat 5: mrfony (11,898)
    Seat 6: weedonk (6,215)
    Seat 7: GutShotJ (9,030)
    Seat 8: LittleWolf (5,865)
    Seat 9: icalleverythimg (8,492)
    kuckla13 antes 50
    A-Mo10 antes 50
    SanDiegoTex antes 50
    Avaskavich antes 50
    mrfony antes 50
    weedonk antes 50
    GutShotJ antes 50
    LittleWolf antes 50
    icalleverythimg antes 50
    icalleverythimg posts the small blind of 200
    kuckla13 posts the big blind of 400
    The button is in seat #8
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to LittleWolf [Kd Kh]
    A-Mo10 calls 400
    SanDiegoTex folds
    Avaskavich folds
    mrfony folds
    weedonk folds
    GutShotJ folds
    LittleWolf raises to 1,600
    icalleverythimg folds
    kuckla13 has 15 seconds left to act
    kuckla13 calls 1,200
    A-Mo10 folds
    *** FLOP *** [2d 2h 2s]
    kuckla13 checks
    LittleWolf bets 4,215, and is all in
    kuckla13 calls 3,131, and is all in
    LittleWolf shows [Kd Kh]
    kuckla13 shows [2c Kc]
    Uncalled bet of 1,084 returned to LittleWolf
    *** TURN *** [2d 2h 2s] [8c]
    *** RIVER *** [2d 2h 2s 8c] [6c]
    LittleWolf shows a full house, Twos full of Kings
    kuckla13 shows four of a kind, Twos
    kuckla13 wins the pot (10,512) with four of a kind, Twos
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 10,512 | Rake 0
    Board: [2d 2h 2s 8c 6c]
    Seat 1: kuckla13 (big blind) showed [2c Kc] and won (10,512) with four of a kind, Twos
    Seat 2: A-Mo10 folded before the Flop
    Seat 3: SanDiegoTex folded before the Flop
    Seat 4: Avaskavich folded before the Flop
    Seat 5: mrfony folded before the Flop
    Seat 6: weedonk folded before the Flop
    Seat 7: GutShotJ folded before the Flop
    Seat 8: LittleWolf (button) showed [Kd Kh] and lost with a full house, Twos full of Kings
    Seat 9: icalleverythimg (small blind) folded before the Flop

    I don't think the lower raise would have changed anything here. So it's really down to the difference between raising and shoving. COULD open shoving have pushed BB out? Likely, but I'm worried that's being too results oriented.
    Thread Starter
  8. Deoxyribo Deoxyribo is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
    United States

    Posts: 5,045
    Joined: Jun 08

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 4:41am) in reply to LittleWolf

    please be more results oriented

    preflop raise 2.5x

    you WANT to get called by Ax... dont be scared of busting because youll be scared of chipping up
     
  9. Champaign Ed Champaign Ed is offline

    Champaign, IL
    United States

    Posts: 65
    Joined: May 07

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 9:19am) in reply to LittleWolf

    your raise to 1600 was fine...just got unlucky

    to answer your question, I would shove if my image at time was laggy, and raise to 1500 if tight
  10. ABorges ABorges is offline

    Sines
    Portugal

    Posts: 272
    Joined: Jul 08

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 9:34am) in reply to LittleWolf

    100% sure people saying to raise 2.5x didn't notice EP limper. You played it fine.
  11. The Lab Rat The Lab Rat is offline

    Costa Rica

    Posts: 2,070
    Joined: Apr 08

    Feb 2nd, 2009 (2/2/2009 12:32pm) in reply to LittleWolf

    I raise to 1600 or 1815(5865- 50 ante. gives u even 4k behind) here all day. These donkeys dont limp and then fold to 4x raises too often. You cant be results oriented with your posts. You want the limpasaurus to call with K2 preflop cause in the long run its so profitable. Midnight Madness is full of donkeys and you want to extract as much chis as possible from them. Just got unlucky but in future play this hand the same way the majority of the time. Gross result tho
    309 
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