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MSNL- ~ 50 left (and deep) in the DEG

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  1. s.l. halper s.l. halper is offline

    Garwood, NJ
    United States

    Posts: 1,017
    Joined: Aug 06

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 2:04am)

    Hey all. Villain was relatively new to the table. Villain is a random and a novice based on OPR (not necessarily a bad player, just had >50 games on Stars, and mostly Midstakes). I was active, not in a crazy way, but a comfortable one. I am pretty sure most of my opens and c-bets went uncontested while this guy was at the table.

    In an ordinary tourney IMO this is an easy 3-ball ship on the flop or turn and nothing really to discuss. However, we are more than 55bbs deep in the best structured non-major online tournament against a BB villain who literally can have anything and may not have a traditional range due to his inexperience.

    I was admittedly lost in this hand (although I did think out each decision and will gladly discuss it after a few responses). Thoughts on my line...and how about that river? Villain put me in pretty quickly too.

    As always, thanks in advance for any responses.

    pokerstars Game #59927289083: Tournament #413010577, $50+$5 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XXX (5000/10000) - 2011/03/27 23:22:51 ET
    Table '413010577 227' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
    Seat 2: ASSYRIAN J2A (77122 in chips)
    Seat 3: Physxr (268805 in chips)
    Seat 4: wpinvestor (290631 in chips)
    Seat 5: humbi07 (560981 in chips)
    Seat 6: Darryn83 (742535 in chips)
    Seat 7: Gurra_1983 (643743 in chips)
    Seat 8: HasLongOnion (441049 in chips)
    Seat 9: s.l. halper (551369 in chips)
    ASSYRIAN J2A: posts the ante 1250
    Physxr: posts the ante 1250
    wpinvestor: posts the ante 1250
    humbi07: posts the ante 1250
    Darryn83: posts the ante 1250
    Gurra_1983: posts the ante 1250
    HasLongOnion: posts the ante 1250
    s.l. halper: posts the ante 1250
    Darryn83: posts small blind 5000
    Gurra_1983: posts big blind 10000
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to s.l. halper [Ad Ah]
    HasLongOnion: folds
    s.l. halper: raises 12345 to 22345
    ASSYRIAN J2A: folds
    Physxr: folds
    wpinvestor: folds
    humbi07: folds
    Darryn83: folds
    Gurra_1983: calls 12345
    *** FLOP *** [9d 7h Kd]
    Gurra_1983: checks
    s.l. halper: bets 27774
    Gurra_1983: raises 62226 to 90000
    s.l. halper: calls 62226
    *** TURN *** [9d 7h Kd] [5s]
    Gurra_1983: bets 170000
    s.l. halper: calls 170000
    *** RIVER *** [9d 7h Kd 5s] [Kh]
    Gurra_1983: bets 300000
    s.l. halper said, "nothing makes sense"
     
  2. Boandaro Boandaro is offline

    Lincoln, NE
    United States

    Posts: 354
    Joined: Mar 09

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 3:14am) in reply to s.l. halper

    If you had been active there are so many hands I play this way in this spot- 88, TT, JJ, sets, AXdd, KT+. Really hard to range someone with 50 games in this spot.

    I really do not see a spot to raise to figure out where you are at without committing yourself to a shove?
    Edited By: Boandaro Mar 30th, 2011 at 03:21 AM
     
  3. Pick6man Pick6man is offline

    Sacramento, CA
    United States

    Posts: 664
    Joined: Nov 07

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 6:55am) in reply to Boandaro

    check raise/bet/bet 55bbs effective is a lot of heat for a pair. Like you said lotta crap in his range and you did call his check raise and turn bet so what do you think he puts you on? His check raise is pretty big too. If you think he is capable of taking this line on a busted draw then I might give it some thought here but more often than not this is a set of 77s or 99s and he is pissing all over himself or a scared AK hand. Also a lot of crappy cards like the J and 8 , any diamond or any K sucks when it hits the river. So if your calling the turn ur hoping he checks it back on the river? I could be way off base but I think the turn is where you decide if you are good or not and perhaps shove or fold. Really player/gameflow dependant as well.
     
  4. FenwayKing FenwayKing is offline The Well: FenwayKing

    Posts: 12,063
    Joined: Mar 06

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 8:02am) in reply to Pick6man

    given that he's a novice, i feel like he's c/r top pair for value a lot here and his flop raise is a lot less polarized than a lot of people would be here in this spot. In this spot, I'm usually going to assume that for the most part he's a level 1 thinker. the size of his flop raise seems like he's either trying to make you "pay" with a draw (if he has Kx or sets for value) although I wouldn't count out the possibility of him having a flush draw himself and trying to get more fold equity by betting bigger. This hand is completely different against a reg especially with the Ad blocker but against this type of villain though, I'm happily trying to get in on the flop, assuming his range will have a lot of Kx, combo draws, and flush draws in it, along with sets. While you fold out some of his bluffs, I don't think he has many pure bluffs here. Just make it slightly over a click-it-back to give some perceived fold equity if he has flush draws/combo draws. If he flats your flop 3b, i'm jamming every turn although you could check a diamond and either call when he shoves (you still have the Ad) or hope the river card bricks out if he checks back, so you can jam and get called by Kx.

    anyway, as played, i think river is a fold. if he has air on the river, which i doubt, given his sizing on flop/turn, i think he'll be pretty scared you have Kx (which is what you look like) and isn't just going to jam it in on that river card. even if he's better than i'm giving him credit for, you never have worse than Kx in this spot after that massive turn bet and you're not going to fold any part of your value range that's Kx+ when all the obvious draws bricked out except for AA which is of course what we have. I just don't think he bluffs this river card enough if he does get to the river with a bluff to make a call profitable. i'm pretty sure he just has it anyway though
    247 1
  5. P8ntMagazine P8ntMagazine is offline

    Posts: 98
    Joined: May 09

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 8:53am) in reply to FenwayKing

    Think after flatting the c/r on the flop you need to be putting him in on the turn or folding. As played by the river you nothing but a bluff catcher and are beating nothing but a missed flush draw. His c/r sizing on the flop is pretty big too which i think is usually some big combo draw or can def be a set due to you two being so deep and trying to have a PSB by river/ charge any monster draws a premium. Less draws in his range too since you have the Ad as someone mentioned. As played you have to fold. Think he shows up with 999 and 777 more than we want to believe. Pretty gross spot though.

    Curious if you remember where they guy was from?
    Edited By: P8ntMagazine Mar 30th, 2011 at 08:54 AM
    Reason: location tell...
  6. red309 red309 is offline

    New York, NY
    United States

    Posts: 67
    Joined: Sep 07

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 6:27pm) in reply to P8ntMagazine

    I think the fact that he may be a novice is why I would fold. Smells like a straight value bet all the way especially with the river K. He cold be bluffing with a missed FD but I would think that he's gonna shut it down on that river card.
  7. Goldenad Goldenad is offline

    NJ
    United States

    Posts: 2,669
    Joined: Jun 06

    Mar 30th, 2011 (3/30/2011 8:41pm) in reply to red309

    i wanted to write a response yesterday to this thread but got distracted. now that i returned to it, i see fenwayking took the words right out of my mouth. bad players are going to c/r top pair and considering how much he likes his hand id definitely put in a small raise so he can jam over it with his draws. now fold the river.
     
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