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MTT Cash rate = 20%... but no Take Downs... Advice plz.

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  1. beaver_belton beaver_belton is offline

    CA
    United States

    Posts: 58
    Joined: Jun 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:14am)

    Hey guys.

    I've been trying to work on my MTT game lately. I have a cash rate on full tilt and bodog of around 20% on both sites. I realize this is too high as it should be around 15%. Also, my highest finish in any MTT is 3rd place. This is through about 70 tournies on bodog and 45 on full tilt.

    I'm wondering if any MTT grinders can throw some pointers at me. I understand tourny strategy and know I should be playing for a top 3 spot, but whenever I find myself "making moves" to get that top 3 spot, I bust out, throw something at the wall, life-tilt, etc, etc, asking myself "what were you doing?"

    I am obviously playing "to cash" too much, but not really sure how to adjust so that my cash rate drops about 5% followed with more top 3 finishes.

    My name on full tilt is "sleepy_beaver" and on bodog is "take_it_EZ" so feel free to db me to check out my stats.

    Thanks for any advice guys,
    Scott
  2. joe bluffit joe bluffit is offline

    Sherman Oaks, CA
    United States

    Posts: 338
    Joined: Dec 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:19am) in reply to beaver_belton

    i cash in the micros all the time....not for much though. I try to get aggressive late and always end up running into big hands.
  3. Faecal Matter Faecal Matter is offline

    New Zealand

    Posts: 613
    Joined: Feb 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:20am) in reply to beaver_belton

    step 1: Play more tourneys

    step 2: Run good

    step 3: Run better

    And obviously play aggressive etc. Also if you haven't already subscribe to a training site.
     
  4. Curtass Curtass is offline

    Afghanistan

    Posts: 4,171
    Joined: May 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:24am) in reply to beaver_belton

    Volume, Volume, Volume....cant stress that enough....just wish I had the time to put in more...
  5. SICKTIGHT311 SICKTIGHT311 is offline

    Long Beach, CA
    United States

    Posts: 24,818
    Joined: Jul 06

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:27am) in reply to beaver_belton

    Scott,

    It sounds like you know what you are doing. You are going to have to play lots more MTTs to get a better idea of how you are doing. Part of "playing for the win" is taking risks, trying to accumulate chips and taking most any +EV situation that comes your way. Always err on the side of aggression, just not recklesness.

    pz lil
  6. beaver_belton beaver_belton is offline

    CA
    United States

    Posts: 58
    Joined: Jun 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:32am) in reply to SICKTIGHT311

    is multi-tabling a must for most MTT grinders?

    I can play 2-4 tables at a time, but I lose focus obviously at each table and miss out on vital information that I would have otherwise gotten if only playing one table...
    Thread Starter
  7. Faecal Matter Faecal Matter is offline

    New Zealand

    Posts: 613
    Joined: Feb 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:35am) in reply to beaver_belton

    Just slowly add more tables and you'll get used to it. I get seriously bored out of my mind playing one or two tables. I find I play better with 4 open. Except if I ever make it to a final table I like having just that open, but that's never.
     
  8. SICKTIGHT311 SICKTIGHT311 is offline

    Long Beach, CA
    United States

    Posts: 24,818
    Joined: Jul 06

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 3:42am) in reply to Faecal Matter

    I kind of agree with Faecal Matter here. I usually have about 4 going on a day where I am going full blast. I know what you mean though beaver, about getting better reads with just one open. It takes some getting used to. I don't like to do much more than 4. I think 6 was the most I ever had going.
  9. pokerskunk pokerskunk is offline

    United States

    Posts: 89
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 6:01am) in reply to beaver_belton

    Build up the multitabling gradually. Everybody can play their A game with 1 table, you'll always pick up better reads on specific players and the table dynamics as a whole. Then 2 table until you feel you can bring your A game and get used to it to the point where you can make the same reads as you would on 1 table. Then try 3 and work your way up.

    You want to reach the point where you're completely fearless in each individual mtt, knowing that losing a single buyin is nothing in the long run, and the only way that single mtt could make the slightest difference long term is if you make the top 3.

    Rail the top pros. I guarentee it's the best value for money tuition you'll ever get. It's free, and watching annette, genius, apestyles, sctrojans, lilholdem, bax, menlo, ajkhoosier etc etc can be very valuable and time well spent. Search the high stakes tournies, find a name you recognise who has a big stack and go and watch how they use it to keep accumulating.

    Pay no attention to your ITM%, just focus on your game, not the arbitrary numbers your results will produce over a small sample.
  10. Cactus Jack 44 Cactus Jack 44 is offline

    Richmond, VA
    United States

    Posts: 55
    Joined: Sep 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 10:57am) in reply to pokerskunk

    <SPAN>Your opponent was a big stack at the table and limped in. You raised big and he just called. Usually means (not all the time, of course) he was looking to see a cheap flop for a chance to hit big. You bumped it and since he's big stack, he can afford to see it - which translates to a small to mid PP or suited A or even suited K (imo).

    Post flop, the only hands you're concerned with are: A-10, K-10s, Q-10s, J-10, 10-10, and 6-6. If he hits, there's no need to get aggressive as there isn't much out there from his angle that can beat him on the turn. So, why would he risk bumping it up and tipping his hand off?

    After his bump, you could've pushed as each card that comes out increases his ability to trip up regardless of the PP. You did get unlucky, but didn't play it poorly. Also, I had 15 minutes to think about this while you had less than 30 seconds. I'm sure with more time, you'd have come to a similar conclusion.

    Finally, ask yourself this: What kind of bet is going to get you to lay the bullets down? If you can't immediately think of one...then push it. Why give him a chance to catch up and then back you into the corner?
    </SPAN><SPAN>
    GL - hope this helps. Cactus.

    Oops - wrong post. Sry dude! </SPAN>
  11. Mr_BigQueso Mr_BigQueso is offline

    Melbourne
    Australia

    Posts: 6,132
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    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 11:00am) in reply to beaver_belton

    my cash rates gotta be like 8%
    572 1
  12. crapshot1 crapshot1 is offline

    Reigate
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 1,036
    Joined: Nov 07

    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 11:03am) in reply to Mr_BigQueso

    getting ITM alot playing lower buyins isnt generally a bad thing but your sample size is way too small to come to any kind of conclusion yet.
     
  13. the devil01 the devil01 is offline

    Oshawa
    Canada

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    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 1:00pm) in reply to SICKTIGHT311

    Do you find that additional software (data mining) makes NTT multi table play any easier?
  14. LitezOut LitezOut is offline

    Wilmington, DE
    United States

    Posts: 2,248
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    Feb 11th, 2008 (2/11/2008 1:54pm) in reply to crapshot1

    I'm with you on this beaver... my ITM is even higher but FT's are surely fewer. I keep trying to break the fold to cash pattern but as you said, I make a small move, get caught, make a big move, get coolered. Even when I accumulate early, I can't seem to get over the hump to really be in position after the bubble.
    In a recent tourny that I went deep in, I remember commenting that I had to rebuild my stack at least a dozen times after getting it in good. I actually don't remember ever having to rebuild that much in a single tourny probably because of busting out before I got the chance. Is that what it takes? The ability to rebuild over and over again without tilting or spewing? Or is it just a steady climb from begining to end? It really gets disheartening after a while. Thanks for any input.
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