my friend believes this is a terrible lay down and i should 5bet shove 3handed. note, bet, min raise, call, min rr, min rr again, with the 2nd re raiser still behind me to act and the co who has now put in 480 in min raises. also this is level 1, about 10 hands in, with 90 bbs still behind me. please tell me what you do after checking the flop and this happening..thank you
pokerstars Game #19211649874: Tournament #98286807, $70+$7 Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2008/07/30 - 00:05:48 (ET)
Table '98286807 27' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: AJacejackAJ (2950 in chips)
Seat 2: AADream$$ (2690 in chips)
Seat 3: LE KEB (3840 in chips)
Seat 4: SYLVIE4AS (2520 in chips)
Seat 5: AAgunner (3060 in chips)
Seat 6: KidPokerJD (2940 in chips) is sitting out
AJacejackAJ: posts small blind 10
AADream$$: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to AJacejackAJ [Kc Jh]
LE KEB: folds
SYLVIE4AS: raises 50 to 70
AJacejackAJ: calls 60
AADream$$: calls 50
*** FLOP *** [Ks Jd 3c]
AADream$$: bets 80
SYLVIE4AS: raises 80 to 160
AJacejackAJ: calls 160
AADream$$: raises 160 to 320
SYLVIE4AS: raises 160 to 480
Uncalled bet (160) returned to SYLVIE4AS
SYLVIE4AS collected 1010 from pot
AJacejackAJ said, "KJ"
SYLVIE4AS: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1010 | Rake 0
Board [Ks Jd 3c]
Seat 1: AJacejackAJ (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 2: AADream$$ (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 3: LE KEB folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: SYLVIE4AS collected (1010)
Seat 5: AAgunner folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: KidPokerJD (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
I agree with your friend. What do you put your opponents on to be able to lay this down?
I assume you must have specifically put someone on a set? Otherwise you're getting your money in way good.
I like the check on the flop when you're first to act, because it induces a bluff or bet from someone with a worse hand. But then make it 400 or so after Sylvie's first preflop raise.
This is the kind of flop you want with KJ, since you could easily be dominated if you hit only one pair. Time to get as many chips in the pot as possible.
I am getting all my chips in the middle here, if I run into a set (I am only really worried about a set of 3's) so be it that is just poker but there is no way I am laying this down.
I don't know about a 5-bet shove, why wait that long? The pot was 210 to start and the 80 could be anything - he put in a 3rd but couldn't stand a 4th so QT seems probable. The orginal raiser has something here, if it happens to be a set oh well, mostly AK, KQ, KJ, AA, QQ, AJ, TT, QT.
OK, so whats your line? You open checked top 2, clearly prep for a check raise - why didn't you follow through? When the action got back to you you've seen a small feeler bet (less than 1/2 pot) and a min raise - at this point I would start looking to double up - that min raise says he likes this flop and is looking for action - us too :) Its 160 to us and the pot is 350, 3x the bet to us is 480 - not too far out of line so a 3-bet in the 450/500 range looks good. If you want to represent QT a 3-bet push is in order but I think you will get the chips in anyway so that isn't really nessary.
A pot size open is also a good line if you feel they may check behind - not much chance of that here.
my 2 cents
As played, I think you would have run into AK here. The real question is... if you call a raise with kj and then fold when you hit the flop hard, why play it at all??
this looks like some garbage play all around, no1 has any idea where anyone is with this min raise crap. so the only one who should be happy about this is guys with sets.
You don't and should have made a larger reraise at some point to find out.
As played I have no idea where you are at and have really no ideal path to take. Cause it looks like a set, but with no reads or previous history on these guys it could be anything as overall this play is retarded. Initial raiser could have AA, no idea what DREAM has.
If they have a set, you are bound to lose a huge amount with top two, i would make the right size raise and try to sucker hands that you are beating into the pot. Without letting draws draw too cheaply and not such a big size that only sets can call you. The size of the bet depends on your opponents history.
However, considering how poor this play is, folding ain't THAT bad as you can probably wait for a better spot to dominate this donk ass play.