Check out our brand new Local Poker Communities! Get updates and interact with poker players in your area.
Visit the United States Poker Community | Visit the California Poker Community | Read more about the Launch of P5s Local

OMAHA advice at a ft.......Lost huge pot...Had huge draw...and he redrew

Reply to Thread
  1. Cortz Cortz is offline

    Youngtown, AZ
    United States

    Posts: 6,736
    Joined: Dec 05

    May 21st, 2006 (5/21/2006 1:24am)

    I know the preflop call was a little loose...but i love hands like this...and every1 playing so tight i figured he had naked aces....and i could crack with a nice flop.

    pokerstars Game #5003186428: Tournament #24673746, $5.00+$0.50 Omaha Pot Limit - Level XV (2000/4000) - 2006/05/21 - 01:15:47 (ET)
    Table '24673746 5' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
    Seat 1: Eye_On_UR_$$ (31585 in chips)
    Seat 2: Cortz (86404 in chips)
    Seat 3: OUT7OUT (19980 in chips)
    Seat 4: guavito (26294 in chips)
    Seat 5: clarkinatarr (29656 in chips)
    Seat 6: 22RCarden (89958 in chips)
    Seat 7: SPAZZM (109338 in chips)
    Seat 8: BTats (55516 in chips)
    Seat 9: fat&50 (85269 in chips)
    22RCarden: posts small blind 2000
    SPAZZM: posts big blind 4000
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Cortz [5h 6s 4s 3d]
    BTats: raises 8000 to 12000
    fat&50: folds
    Eye_On_UR_$$: folds
    Cortz: calls 12000
    OUT7OUT: folds
    guavito: folds
    clarkinatarr: folds
    22RCarden: folds
    SPAZZM: calls 8000
    *** FLOP *** [3s 2d Ks]
    SPAZZM: checks
    BTats: bets 38000
    Cortz: raises 36404 to 74404 and is all-in
    SPAZZM: folds
    BTats: calls 5516 and is all-in
    *** TURN *** [3s 2d Ks] [5c]
    *** RIVER *** [3s 2d Ks 5c] [3c]
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    BTats: shows [Kc Kh 2c 3h] (a full house, Kings full of Threes)
    Cortz: shows [5h 6s 4s 3d] (a full house, Threes full of Fives)
    BTats collected 125032 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 125032 | Rake 0
    Board [3s 2d Ks 5c 3c]
    Seat 1: Eye_On_UR_$$ folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 2: Cortz showed [5h 6s 4s 3d] and lost with a full house, Threes full of Fives
    Seat 3: OUT7OUT folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 4: guavito folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 5: clarkinatarr (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 6: 22RCarden (small blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 7: SPAZZM (big blind) folded on the Flop
    Seat 8: BTats showed [Kc Kh 2c 3h] and won (125032) with a full house, Kings full of Threes
    Seat 9: fat&50 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

    I spoke to a buddy of mine and he said it was a bad call on the flop...I completely disagreed...because well i played that hand to hit a flop like that...I had a flush draw...and ton of str8 draw outs. When i saw his hand...He had really very small outs to win after i hit the turn. I felt in playing to win i have to call here. I felt the river was unfortunate because the cards he needed were all dead and he was drawing to a very small number of outs...(case 3 river)

    anywho just want some opinions.
  2. Qcity Qcity is offline

    Thailand

    Posts: 427
    Joined: May 05

    May 21st, 2006 (5/21/2006 3:28am) in reply to Cortz

    Preflop the call was a little loose since he is betting 1/5 of his stack preflop which takes away your implied odds, but its not a bad call either, just a loose gambling call, which if you make good decisions on the flop is +ev.

    Once the flop comes there is no way you are folding, you have one of the biggest draws in the game. Anyone who says it was a bad call on the flop does not know anything about Omaha. I've played thousands of hands of Omaha and one rarely flops draws this big.

    As the hand turned out you ended up being a slight favorite against a set of kings. He flopped his best possible hand with top set and the nuts, and its still an underdog, thats the power of draws in Omaha. Of course you couldn't know he had a set of kings and in tourney poker, where players are very loose aggressive, he could of had a wide range of hands. Here are your odds against a few different hands he might hold that people like to raise with:

    Against his set of kings: 59% favorite
    Against straight aces with no draws (say AAJ10): 71%
    Against nut flush draw and pair of kings (AKQ10): 37%
    Nut Flush draw and no pair (AQJ10) 53%
    Pair of kings no flush draw (AKQ10): 72%
    Top two pair no draws (AKJ3): 64%

    As you can see you are favorite of just about everything he might hold plus you already have good pot odds too. The only hand you really have to worry about is a made hand, i.e. a pocket pair or pair of kings with a higher flush draw, but thats not very likely. In this situation the two most likely hands he holds is AA, KK, or if hes a loose aggressive player or just a donk AK.

    As it turned out he had KK, which is a coinflip weighted in your favor. Just as in No Limit, Omaha tourneys and big pots often come down to coinflips and you just happen to lose that one.
     
  3. Sooted57 Sooted57 is offline

    Lincoln, NE
    United States

    Posts: 1,338
    Joined: Jul 05

    May 21st, 2006 (5/21/2006 5:27am) in reply to Qcity

    I don't think there is much else you can do here. This is the perfect hand for a stop and go... if you hit a decent flop/draw and think your opponent won't be able to call. As it turns out, the flop is too good for that kind of play, so you check - wanting his action. He happens to have the best possible made hand, which is still a dog, and you get unlucky.

    Let's say you lead out on the flop instead... at the FT your opponent is probably going to be good enough to not call off his stack with whatever wide range of hands that he is raising with, and you lose tons of value. He just happened to have that 1 hand.

    Anyone who criticizes your play here is really lacking in Omaha experience IMHO
Reply to Thread