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Paranoia Paranoia Everybody's coming to get you

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  1. Goal4Ziggy Goal4Ziggy is offline

    Brooklyn, NY
    United States

    Posts: 1,296
    Joined: Jul 06

    Nov 8th, 2007 (11/8/2007 5:28pm)

    It seems to me that stealing, re-stealing and 3-betting in sngs,mtts,and cash games is becoming more and more common, even in the lower levels. It may be at the point where deep in a tourney, the sb having AK and the bb having KQ may be a "cooler".

    With all this going on, it seems many players are becoming "paranoid". Meaning that they are more and more likely to think someone is putting a move on them, even if they have no history with the person or haven't even played a hand with them. This leads to a lot of re-shoving, and calling where a clear fold is in order

    Below are 3 hands I played earlier today where I believe people are just being "paranoid" (including 1 where I am). I am wondering if anyone has noticed this trend, and if they have adjusted their game to exploit this. Whether this means tightening steal ranges so when you do get played back at you often have a hand or doing other things to gain psychological leverage against players who think everyone is always stealing.

    <span>Despite this being the 4th hand or so and me coming over the top of a 4x raise, I am given no credit. (This is a turbo ds btw, so I am trying to accumulate all the chips plus the 4x raise is often 88+, AT,AJ,AQ)</span>
    pokerstars Game #13115041936: Tournament #65953491, $10.70+$1.00 Hold'em No Limit - Match Round I, Level II (15/30) - 2007/11/08 - 12:55:14 (ET)
    Table '65953491 8' 10-max Seat #9 is the button
    Seat 1: TheNextEpiC (2930 in chips)
    Seat 4: Goal4Ziggy (3010 in chips)
    Seat 6: noepfus (1430 in chips)
    Seat 9: SirEuro (1630 in chips)
    TheNextEpiC: posts small blind 15
    Goal4Ziggy: posts big blind 30
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    <span>Dealt to Goal4Ziggy [Ad Kh]</span>
    noepfus: folds
    SirEuro: folds
    <span>TheNextEpiC: raises 90 to 120</span>
    <span>Goal4Ziggy: raises 2890 to 3010 and is all-in</span>
    <span>TheNextEpiC: calls 2810 and is all-in</span>
    *** FLOP *** [6s Jc 7c]
    *** TURN *** [6s Jc 7c] [Jd]
    *** RIVER *** [6s Jc 7c Jd] [Th]
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    <span>TheNextEpiC: shows [Tc Ah] (two pair, Jacks and Tens)</span>
    Goal4Ziggy: shows [Ad Kh] (a pair of Jacks)
    TheNextEpiC collected 5860 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 5860 | Rake 0
    Board [6s Jc 7c Jd Th]
    Seat 1: TheNextEpiC (small blind) showed [Tc Ah] and won (5860) with two pair, Jacks and Tens
    Seat 4: Goal4Ziggy (big blind) showed [Ad Kh] and lost with a pair of Jacks
    Seat 6: noepfus folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 9: SirEuro (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

    <span>This hand may seem a little odd. A few days ago, I played about 10 hands at a table with this guy and noticed he was super aggro check-raising a lot of c-bets and bumping it up anytime someone limped his blind. I played this as more of an experiment to see how effective limp-raising someone's blind like this would work. Lucklily I actually hit with my rags. The way it played out, clearly this player did not have much of a hand. Even though he was correct, and I was on a move, can he assume this having never played a pot with me?</span>

    PokerStars Game #13115325823: Hold'em No Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2007/11/08 - 13:11:34 (ET)
    Table 'Angetenar V' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
    Seat 2: d4ph ($4.70 in chips)
    Seat 3: $ MNF $ ($9.25 in chips)
    Seat 4: Goal4Ziggy ($51.70 in chips)
    Seat 5: Bas105 ($50 in chips)
    Goal4Ziggy: posts small blind $0.25
    Bas105: posts big blind $0.50
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    <span>Dealt to Goal4Ziggy [Jc 8c]</span>
    d4ph: folds
    d4ph leaves the table
    $ MNF $: folds
    Goal4Ziggy: calls $0.25
    <span>Bas105: raises $1.50 to $2</span>
    <span>Goal4Ziggy: raises $5 to $7</span>
    <span>Bas105: calls $5</span>
    *** FLOP *** [Jh 8h 6c]
    <span>Goal4Ziggy: bets $9</span>
    <span>Bas105: raises $11.50 to $20.50</span>
    <span>Goal4Ziggy: raises $24.20 to $44.70 and is all-in</span>
    Kroook joins the table at seat #2
    111Dog1111 joins the table at seat #1
    Bas105: folds
    Goal4Ziggy collected $53 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot $55 | Rake $2
    Board [Jh 8h 6c]
    Seat 2: d4ph folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 3: $ MNF $ (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 4: Goal4Ziggy (small blind) collected ($53)
    Seat 5: Bas105 (big blind) folded on the Flop

    <span>Here I am the victim, I saw this player raise 2.5 x the blinds from the button and co so I decide to shove his min bet with my KJo.</span>
    PokerStars Game #13116542552: Tournament #66562253, $25+$2 Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2007/11/08 - 14:24:12 (ET)
    Table '66562253 1' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
    Seat 1: flippie18 (3085 in chips)
    Seat 3: Gaspoker (3050 in chips)
    Seat 4: jasoakridge (3605 in chips)
    Seat 5: KnockItStiff (2900 in chips)
    Seat 6: swoop06 (2105 in chips)
    Seat 7: mikeAA1981 (2275 in chips)
    Seat 8: Goal4Ziggy (2845 in chips)
    mikeAA1981: posts small blind 75
    Goal4Ziggy: posts big blind 150
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Goal4Ziggy [Kd Jh]
    flippie18: folds
    Gaspoker: folds
    jasoakridge: folds
    KnockItStiff: folds
    swoop06: folds
    mikeAA1981: raises 150 to 300
    Goal4Ziggy: raises 2545 to 2845 and is all-in
    mikeAA1981: calls 1975 and is all-in
    *** FLOP *** [Th Qh Kc]
    *** TURN *** [Th Qh Kc] [3s]
    *** RIVER *** [Th Qh Kc 3s] [Td]
    *** SHOW DOWN ***
    mikeAA1981: shows [As Ac] (two pair, Aces and Tens)
    Goal4Ziggy: shows [Kd Jh] (two pair, Kings and Tens)
    mikeAA1981 collected 4550 from pot
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 4550 | Rake 0
    Board [Th Qh Kc 3s Td]
    Seat 1: flippie18 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 3: Gaspoker folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 4: jasoakridge folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 5: KnockItStiff folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 6: swoop06 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 7: mikeAA1981 (small blind) showed [As Ac] and won (4550) with two pair, Aces and Tens
    Seat 8: Goal4Ziggy (big blind) showed [Kd Jh] and lost with two pair, Kings and Tens
  2. Jennifear Jennifear is offline

    Niagara Falls, NY
    United States

    Posts: 10,222
    Joined: Nov 05

    Nov 8th, 2007 (11/8/2007 5:31pm) in reply to Goal4Ziggy

    In the first hand, you weren't given no credit. He just looked at his cards, thought they were pretty good, and called.

    On hand three, you possibly should have known something was amiss when he deviated from his standard raise.
  3. korey729 korey729 is offline

    Edwardsville, IL
    United States

    Posts: 3,766
    Joined: Oct 06

    Nov 8th, 2007 (11/8/2007 6:21pm) in reply to Goal4Ziggy

    thanks for getting flagpole sitta stuck in my head
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