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PLO from NL.. advice please

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  1. 56off56 56off56 is offline

    Richmond Hill
    Canada

    Posts: 455
    Joined: Sep 08

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 1:03am)

    Could be wrong, but it seems as if PLO take a lot more balls than NL.
    any good advice as to how and learn the game best?
    thanks.
  2. P0KERDUUDE P0KERDUUDE is offline

    NH
    United States

    Posts: 1,607
    Joined: Feb 08

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 1:07am) in reply to 56off56

    more balls...not really. NL actually takes more balls I think. PLO requires more math based playing.

    I made the switch to PLO from NL about 3 months ago, and was loving it. Then the DOJ had to come and ruin it all.

    I would subscribe to a training site that has the kind of game you want to play. That's the best way to learn.
     
  3. gjallen1975 gjallen1975 is offline

    Posts: 1,162
    Joined: Jan 10

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 2:33am) in reply to P0KERDUUDE

    -Don't call 2 pair
    -Play primarily for NUT hands
    -c/f in PLO wont get you flamed on P5 quite as much - it's a drawing game much more than NLHE.
    -Scoop, Scoop, and Scoop.
    -Agree with previous poster- less balls; more math. however, the big bluff can be effective in PLO8 because players are so unwilling to call big bets without the nuts. GL
  4. clantaztic clantaztic is offline

    O Fallon, MO
    United States

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    Joined: Aug 09

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 2:51am) in reply to gjallen1975

    This may sound dumb, but even though I haven't watched the videos I'm sure nsingers vids on here are good. Have played alot of plo and plo8 with him and he's great. Would be a good idea to get into his head for some of the MTTs he plays.
  5. PocketSims PocketSims is offline

    Posts: 1,638
    Joined: Nov 06

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 4:34am) in reply to clantaztic

    i always thought nuts this nuts that too. but watch the omaha on poker after dark. the hands the guys play are all connected at the to and sooted. plo plays big around the st8 draws and re draws obv helps to have re draws to the flush for extra outs.u can get in to see the flop cheap and even see the turn cheap to see if u then want to play a big pot. pm me if u have questions
  6. MacGyver72 MacGyver72 is offline

    Columbia, SC
    United States

    Posts: 239
    Joined: Jan 06

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 4:44am) in reply to PocketSims

    It's similar it terms of balls i suppose. You can play small to mid stakes nl or plo just playing an abc style just value betting and not having to play with any balls at all really and still grind out a profit. But to become one of the top players at the smaller stakes or in order to win at all in the bigger games you have to learn how to bluff effectively and value bet lighter. The main difference is value betting light in holdem may be betting 2nd or 3rd pair on the river etc while value betting light in plo is betting the Jhi flush or the bottom end of a straight. But i feel like math and pot odds can help you make thin calls/bets in plo whereas in nl you dont have as many backdoor draws to justify a thin call. I'm currently moving from PLO to NL and finding the transition to be easier than when i originally went from NL to PLO back in the day
  7. Stoneface Stoneface is offline

    Edmonton
    Canada

    Posts: 168
    Joined: Oct 07

    Apr 26th, 2011 (4/26/2011 8:13am) in reply to MacGyver72

    Position is huge, way huger than in NLH
    Big draws to the nuts are king
    "Made" hands like 2 pair and bottom set are often trap hands. The NLH inequivalent for bottom set is like KJ on a Jxx board. If all the money goes in against someone who isnt a total donktard, you are either flipping or way behind.

    re: the PAD PLO games, shorthanded PLO is much less nut-campy. But full ring is a drawing to the nuts game for the most part. With 9 players and the board, 41 out of 52 cards will be in play. People play any suited aces and big cards. So your non-nut flush and straight draws often go way way down in value.
  8. Mr Galt Mr Galt is offline sister-in-law's a ho

    Overland Park, KS
    United States

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    Apr 27th, 2011 (4/27/2011 4:56am) in reply to Stoneface

    you can easily flop the nuts and be a dog

    set mining is not cool

    you have less fold equity than you might think

    don't repop Jason Mercier from the BB with less than 50bbs. sigh
  9. racer racer is offline

    Gananoque
    Canada

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    Apr 27th, 2011 (4/27/2011 2:11pm) in reply to MacGyver72

     
    Originally Posted by MacGyver72 View Post

    It's similar it terms of balls i suppose. You can play small to mid stakes nl or plo just playing an abc style just value betting and not having to play with any balls at all really and still grind out a profit. But to become one of the top players at the smaller stakes or in order to win at all in the bigger games you have to learn how to bluff effectively and value bet lighter. The main difference is value betting light in holdem may be betting 2nd or 3rd pair on the river etc while value betting light in plo is betting the Jhi flush or the bottom end of a straight. But i feel like math and pot odds can help you make thin calls/bets in plo whereas in nl you dont have as many backdoor draws to justify a thin call. I'm currently moving from PLO to NL and finding the transition to be easier than when i originally went from NL to PLO back in the day

    have to agree with this for the most part, although i cant stress enough the importance of position in relation to bluffing effectively and/or just being in +EV spots in general.

    In relation to 'having balls'...dont make the mistake too often of bloating the pot pre-flop with your AAxx type hands, typically against the aggro donks who nail the board with there 9J87 type hands. If your gonna build a pot and try to find some balls, do it with your dubble gutters, open-enders, and flush draws and re-draws on the turn, and for god sakes..please run well above everything else.
  10. PocketSims PocketSims is offline

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    Apr 27th, 2011 (4/27/2011 9:38pm) in reply to Stoneface

     
    Originally Posted by Stoneface View Post

    Position is huge, way huger than in NLH
    Big draws to the nuts are king
    "Made" hands like 2 pair and bottom set are often trap hands. The NLH inequivalent for bottom set is like KJ on a Jxx board. If all the money goes in against someone who isnt a total donktard, you are either flipping or way behind.

    re: the PAD PLO games, shorthanded PLO is much less nut-campy. But full ring is a drawing to the nuts game for the most part. With 9 players and the board, 41 out of 52 cards will be in play. People play any suited aces and big cards. So your non-nut flush and straight draws often go way way down in value.

    ya i do agree with the 9 handed games are always drawing at the nuts
  11. garyak1 garyak1 is offline

    Grande Prairie
    Canada

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    Apr 30th, 2011 (4/30/2011 7:59pm) in reply to PocketSims

    I've been playing PLO mtts at micro and low buy ins for 3 years. I have studied nsinger and scott clements videos and read a couple books. There are tons of gambling fish in this game. The overall quality of player is weak in my opinion. There are many regular players of course, that you will come to recognize . NLHE games over the last few years have so many better and more skilled players compared to PLO. So there is a ton of value in learning this game. For advice, position is huge. This is a post-flop game. With AA type hands it's ok to bloat the pot pre-flop with heads up or 3 handed while in position. With AAxx type hands don't over play them-a common mistake-especially in a multiway pot post-flop. Your AA hands increase in value if they're single or double suited and hopefully connected xx cards. Post-flop be carefull chasing non nut straights and non nut flushes( or poor fl draws-show caution comiting many chips here -slow down ). I feel you have to make people pay on the flop if it's draw heavy and you have a set. Always be prepared to slow down or give up in this situation when the action and the turn or river really looks like a made straight or flush depending on the bet size. If you have a made full house ( especially top boat) on the turn or river when the board appears to have made a straight or flush it is truly value town time. Learn how strong large wrap draws are post-flop and play them accordingly. Like all forms of poker, putting in a ton of volume will add to your success; it did for me. One of the most important concepts I have learned is that post-flop in a multiway pot your flush, straight draws or made flushes and straights can be rendered useless if there is a paired board! Check raising out of position against an agressive late position opponent is very effective depending on board texture. With KsQs10c4d type hands the 4d is considered a dangler and reduces your starting hand strength, especially out of position, i always fold these oop. These are ok to open on the button when first to act. I hope this helps...good luck at PLO, it is a fantastic, fun game filled with action and potentially very profitable.
    Edited By: garyak1 Apr 30th, 2011 at 08:34 PM
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