[x]

See Where You Rank in New Jersey

  1. I routinely get big pairs cracked in low limit games. Understanding that big pairs don't play well in multi-way pots, I typically raise or re-reraise from any position with AA, KK, or QQ. Nevertheless, in the loose 3/6, 4/8 or the occasional 8/16 games I will get three or four people cold calling two or three bets cold. I'll keep my foot on the gas the whole way unless some really obvious draws make it on the board or until someone raise my bet, but still I find people passively hanging in to the river and they catch a crazy two pair or their under pocket pair makes the miracle set. Sometimes, it's the flush lovers that catch.

    I'm torn on what to do. On one hand, I almost want to check and call my pair to keep the drawing odds low and the pot small when my KK is facing four opponents. However, my tendency is to keep my foot on the gas to make people pay for those draws. The problem is that when I'm facing four dopes that don't know to fold, one of them routinely hits their kiccker on the river and I lose the big pot I helped build. Seems to happen way to often...any suggestions?
  2. Tell the dealer to stop giving you AA, KK and QQ, and give you winning hands.
  3. Tried that already. Thanks.
    Thread Starter
  4. You have to play your strong hands strong, you will get them cracked sometimes but those are the hands you will make your money on. Nothing you can do if you are the favorite.

    Another thing, if you know that they hit there hand or draw don't be afraid to lay the hand down. Sometimes AA, KK, QQ arent good and you have to save yourself money in these situations.
     
    Raise
  5. I haven't had any problem laying them down when I know I'm beat. Just had a rash of bad results on these hands for the past two months. Seems like a very long time to get cracked over and over again. Maybe it's just a really ugly run, but I've considered treating all pocket pairs equally in these types of games. If I don't hit a set, I'm on defense. But, I hate defense...I'd rather bet and raise.
    Raise
    Thread Starter
  6. This is a problem at mid limit games such as 20-40 and 30/60. Limits dont always dictate the crazy play. Key is to pound on them when you think you have the best hand. That will compensate you for the bad beats.

    What you do not want to do is become passive and let them take control of the hand. This will result in 3 things-

    1) Allow them to catch up to you
    2) Does not give you the proper payout when your hand holds up
    3) Weak/Passive Table Image

    For example - this is a hand that occured on Saturday at Mirage 40/80 game.

    I have KK on the button and 1st position raises (Loose Aggressive Player). I reraise to isolate. Flop comes Q-3-2 with 2 spades and he leads out. Even if you are afraid of losing to the flush, RAISE. He calls. Turn comes another 2. He leads again. Unless you think he has AA or a set raise him again. He calls. River is a spade. Now here is where your raising might actually save you a bet. He checked and i checked behind. he rivered the flush. Your aggression jammmed the pot when you were a faovrite (+EV) and allowed your opponent to expect a river bet (+EV to you again). By checking behind you actually gain Equity in the hand if he has the flush since his missed bet is the equivelant of you winning a bet.

    By being aggressive you will allow yourself to take control of the hand allowing you to decide the pace at which it will be played. Don't be results oriented. If you jame the pot when you are ahead you will make money in the long run. The key is to get as much money out of the opponent so when his flush doesnt hit 67% of the time you make MAX PROFIT.

    GL.
    Raise
  7. Coming from a limit junkie, ya gotta play the big pairs hard, but be ready to lay them down if a crazy flop/turn comes. They will get cracked from time to time, and you'll hit second set with QQ only to run into a higher set of KK (not that this is causing any bitterness at all, lol), but the right play over the LONG haul is to play them aggressively. That's why you're practising proper bankroll management (Fox rules!) and riding the bumps and valleys on the steady climb to profits. Remember that limit is all about saving the odd bet here and there, so check the rest of your play to see if there's other leaks. If not, just weather the storm/step down a level and you'll be back in the black soon enough.
    Raise
  8. OK, thanks for the advice. Definitely helps my confidence, that I'm not playing poorly. Just getting a variance haircut. :)
    Thread Starter
  9. Other than "Happens to all ofus and I know it sucks". The best advice I can give is to find ways to ruin your opponents odds and punish them when you are ahead. Whether it's check raising, waiting until the turn to bet, or betting when you know the guy after you will raise, you have to find ways to charge your opponents dearly for trying to suck out on you.

    It's also important to realise that in a 4 way pot your KK does suck unless you flop a set, and if people are very interested in the pot on the flop and turn you may need to either slow down or fold your hand and wait for the next one. Have you read Small Stakes Hold Em and King Yaos Weighing the Odds?
    Raise
  10. I've read Small Stakes Hold Em, and I'll check out the other recommendation. Thanks for the advice Fox!

    I think I'm in the "it happens to all of us" category after reading these posts. If I'm out of position, I'll check raise if I know that someone is going to bet the pot for me, and I'll raise if I'm in position to make 'em pay. Just getting some bad results over the past two months that had me doubting myself...which can make matters worse, so I wanted to hear what you all thought. Thanks again for the boost!
    Raise
    Thread Starter