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Spot with QQ in the Stars nightly 100k

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  1. Askesis_ Askesis_ is offline

    Tampa, FL
    United States

    Posts: 3,066
    Joined: Jan 06

    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:04am)

    Alright, what's your play here with QQ? I found this to be a pretty tough spot. We're 5 off the bubble, I'm sitting approx 20/80. I'm new to this table and scossett raised one hand in the one orbit I've been here, and I haven't raised a hand since I've been at the table.

    My line is obviously strong, and then he go ahead and 4-bets obviously committing himself. I took a lot of time on this decision, and it's obviously push or fold. If we both get all in, the winner will be the chip eader. I am interested in your thoughts and will post results later.

    pokerstars Game #29271702714: Tournament #169702202, $150+$12 Hold'em No Limit - Level XI (400/800) - 2009/06/11 23:55:19 ET
    Table '169702202 51' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
    Seat 1: Queres (20630 in chips)
    Seat 2: VARICO (12789 in chips)
    Seat 3: jinglenutz (20554 in chips)
    Seat 4: Z@D0 (44956 in chips)
    Seat 5: scossett (42094 in chips)
    Seat 6: Askesis1017 (33103 in chips)
    Seat 7: Money800 (53467 in chips)
    Seat 8: treefella (64623 in chips)
    Seat 9: Mavericci (40782 in chips)
    Queres: posts the ante 75
    VARICO: posts the ante 75
    jinglenutz: posts the ante 75
    Z@D0: posts the ante 75
    scossett: posts the ante 75
    Askesis1017: posts the ante 75
    Money800: posts the ante 75
    treefella: posts the ante 75
    Mavericci: posts the ante 75
    VARICO: posts small blind 400
    jinglenutz: posts big blind 800
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to Askesis1017 [Qs Qh]
    Z@D0: folds
    scossett: raises 1600 to 2400
    Askesis1017: raises 4000 to 6400
    Money800: folds
    treefella: folds
    Mavericci: folds
    Queres: folds
    VARICO: folds
    jinglenutz: folds
    scossett: raises 12000 to 18400
     
  2. riverdrowns riverdrowns is offline

    Yuma, AZ
    United States

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:15am) in reply to Askesis_

    when you decided to 3bet did you have any idea as to what you were going to do if he 4bet? this should be going through your mind before you even decide to 3bet. i probably am never folding here. setting yourself up to win the tournament is huge here and if he has you dominated then its just a cooler imo.
  3. MoneyOr2 MoneyOr2 is offline

    Columbia, MO
    United States

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:15am) in reply to Askesis_

    read dependent but your never better than against AK
  4. LoudNoise LoudNoise is offline

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:17am) in reply to Askesis_

    I shove and lose, but I shove.
  5. Abratzzi Abratzzi is offline

    TX
    United States

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:17am) in reply to Askesis_

    wow puke spot I think ak at best case for you hes early pos raise fold. KK AA doubt JJ but thats bottom of range I think ad thats goin out on a limb.<input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">
  6. zspokerpink zspokerpink is offline

    Sherwood Park
    Canada

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:19am) in reply to MoneyOr2

    I fold, his 4 bet looks like a real milker.
  7. Askesis_ Askesis_ is offline

    Tampa, FL
    United States

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:22am) in reply to riverdrowns

     
    Originally Posted by riverdrowns View Post

    when you decided to 3bet did you have any idea as to what you were going to do if he 4bet? this should be going through your mind before you even decide to 3bet. i probably am never folding here. setting yourself up to win the tournament is huge here and if he has you dominated then its just a cooler imo.

    It was more the fact that he raised but didn't push that threw me off. I was hoping to attract a push (obviously from an inferior hand), and when he raised the amount he did, it made me think of his range compared to my hand. I figured AK would push, not make this raise amount. AA-QQ could definitely be in his range. I would think he would push or fold pairs JJ and below, not make the raise he did.

    Forget waiting until later to post results because results don't matter. I ended making the push and won the race against AK. I'm still not sure if the play is correct, since I may have just hit the bottom end of his range
     
    Thread Starter
  8. n2kfactor n2kfactor is offline

    Fremont, CA
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:24am) in reply to Askesis_

    i would fold
  9. riverdrowns riverdrowns is offline

    Yuma, AZ
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:28am) in reply to n2kfactor

    i just think that after you 3bet, you shouldnt be folding QQ there.
  10. 8ntmuch 8ntmuch is offline

    Meridian, ID
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:30am) in reply to riverdrowns

     
    Originally Posted by riverdrowns View Post

    i just think that after you 3bet, you shouldnt be folding QQ there.

    I agree... QQ is to strong to turn into a bluff...
  11. jtj03 jtj03 is offline

    Malta

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:43am) in reply to 8ntmuch

    As played you have to call, one can not 3 bet QQ and fold, pretty standard advice there. As for his range Ak is the very bottom of his range and yes you are correct there. His 4 bet just made his hand look stronger than it was. My vote is 2 people that played there hands perfectly. Hope you took it down
    643 
  12. n2kfactor n2kfactor is offline

    Fremont, CA
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:46am) in reply to jtj03

    Any thoughts on what the villain would do with JJ/TT after being reraised?
  13. riverdrowns riverdrowns is offline

    Yuma, AZ
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 12:53am) in reply to n2kfactor

     
    Originally Posted by n2kfactor View Post

    Any thoughts on what the villain would do with JJ/TT after being reraised?

    im thinking he plays JJ the same and shoves or folds TT.
  14. jmm7258 jmm7258 is offline

    Chicago, IL
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:01am) in reply to Askesis_

    fold here.. scossett is a real good high stakes hu player-220s-570s.. his 4 bet range is never light there
  15. TheVillageGrinder TheVillageGrinder is offline

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:06am) in reply to Askesis_

    this is why 3 betting QQ pre, esp w/out info, sux. And when you did this, what exactly did you hope would happen? when you three bet here, all ur accomplishing is getting him to fold out the portion of his range ur absolutely crushing.

    As played I rly don't know what to say because I'd never be puting myself in that spot. But folding the third best starting hand in poker seems rly gay.
  16. JuliusC JuliusC is offline

    Los Angeles, CA
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:17am) in reply to TheVillageGrinder

    fold, wat???? Is this thread one giant level? You people think his 4bet range here is KK/AA?

    I sincerely hope I'm not getting owned here by a crazy level..
  17. riverdrowns riverdrowns is offline

    Yuma, AZ
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:23am) in reply to JuliusC

     
    Originally Posted by JuliusC View Post

    fold, wat???? Is this thread one giant level? You people think his 4bet range here is KK/AA?

    I sincerely hope I'm not getting owned here by a crazy level..

    sick edit

    you dont read too many hand discussions here do you? that last sentence is something that goes through a lot of peoples minds after reading some.
  18. Dead Money Dom Dead Money Dom is offline

    Buffalo, NY
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:26am) in reply to Askesis_

    i'm shippen them in everytime.
     
  19. darkhawk-200 darkhawk-200 is offline

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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:31am) in reply to Dead Money Dom

    i like a flat pre if you are not calling the 4bet, as played i'd ship it in since it looks like he's making his hand look stronger than it is and with kk's and aa's, he flatting you a good percentage of times with aa's and kk's and it is the money bubble, so he can be 4 betting lighter than normal since he has you covered.
     1
  20. JuliusC JuliusC is offline

    Los Angeles, CA
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    Jun 12th, 2009 (6/12/2009 1:46am) in reply to riverdrowns

     
    Originally Posted by riverdrowns View Post

     
    Originally Posted by JuliusC View Post

    fold, wat???? Is this thread one giant level? You people think his 4bet range here is KK/AA?

    I sincerely hope I'm not getting owned here by a crazy level..

    sick edit

    you dont read too many hand discussions here do you? that last sentence is something that goes through a lot of peoples minds after reading some.

    Yeah my bad I thought OP had him covered .Either way, their stack sizes are close enough that the difference is negligible..

    I still can't imagine everybody in this thread is leveling though. Some ppl. think QQ is a fold here which is beyond mind-boggling.
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