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Thoughts about UTG Steals...

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  1. rmthawk64 rmthawk64 is offline

    Dundalk, MD
    United States

    Posts: 47
    Joined: May 07

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 6:56am)

    I personally am not a huge fan of UTG steals. I do throw it in at times, but very rarely.

    I was just curious what you guys thought about this play, when it's most effective, and both the reasons why it's a +ev play, and for the others why it's spewy.
     
  2. lordxixor101 lordxixor101 is offline

    Westland, MI
    United States

    Posts: 6,364
    Joined: Mar 06

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 7:25am) in reply to rmthawk64

    In lower limit games, it's a very spewey move. This is because, for the most part, players don't respect UTG raises as any stronger than any other raise. Some donkey players might even think it's a steal (with nothing to back it up). So, you attempt to steal, you have to go through most of the players, and if it doesn't work, you will likely be out of posiiton. Positional raises work very well in this.

    UTG steals (I would think in theory) would really only work at a rather intellegent table that is going to respect the UTG raise as very strong (the sorts of tables where people will lay down AJ/AQ in good position against that sort of raise, thinking they are behind).

    At best, I would think this would be a rarely used move by someone with a tight image.
  3. welshFARg0 welshFARg0 is offline

    Rock Hill, SC
    United States

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    Joined: Dec 07

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:00pm) in reply to lordxixor101

    When you are stealing from anywhere but the button the WORST thing that can happen is for you to be flat called. If you are flat called oop you will usually have to commit more chips to bluffing postflop b/c if you just check/fold postflop people will start calling you in position/ floating you, etc left and right.

    If they raise/shove over ur steal it sucks but you dont have to feel obligated to commit more chips. If they fold great.

    I try to steal oop with hands that somewhat reduce the possibility of a "calling hand" from a donk or strong positional player. Hands that might flat a raise on the button or getting better odds in the blinds like QJs, KQ, etc. So raising Qx and Kx and even 10x hands on steals slightly decreases the odds someone will be dealt a hand that might flat call you (like the infamous 10J which no one likes to fold)
  4. TiltinShoes TiltinShoes is offline

    Posts: 7,076
    Joined: Sep 07

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:03pm) in reply to welshFARg0

    UTG steal should be used very sparingly and preferbably short handed.
  5. golteb golteb is offline

    Tokyo
    Japan

    Posts: 169
    Joined: Jan 08

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:14pm) in reply to TiltinShoes

    i try it sometimes if i have some chips and i've been moved to a new table and haven't played a pot yet. i usually get the blinds in this scenario at low buy-in MTTs even.
  6. crapshot1 crapshot1 is offline

    Reigate
    United Kingdom

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    Joined: Nov 07

    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:17pm) in reply to golteb

    dont think the risk/reward is worth it at a full table.
     
  7. bruha47 bruha47 is offline

    Chicago, IL
    United States

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    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:23pm) in reply to crapshot1

    i only use it when it is shorthanded or ur on the bubble...the play can become pretty effective then
  8. TiltinShoes TiltinShoes is offline

    Posts: 7,076
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    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:26pm) in reply to bruha47

    Honestly I remember I was playing the FTP central time nooner one time which is a 6 handed event and there was a dude at my table that had ammassed this stupid stack and he was literally raising UTG every orbit and getting folds. Well long story short it only took two orbits for him to lose his whole stack that he earned to another guy and I. As I said, use it sparingly.
  9. TheVillageGrinder TheVillageGrinder is offline

    United States

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    Jan 30th, 2008 (1/30/2008 12:31pm) in reply to rmthawk64

    Deep in t'ment where you haven't been active for a while and you wanna chip up a bit to ease the hit of the upcoming blinds--this is when you might try. Always good to have some kind of a hand as well, just in case you do get flatted, you have the possibility of hitting something on the flop.

    I agree with the poster who said getting flatted is the worst but if its just one caller you usually have a good chance of cbetting him off his hand, especially if the flop comes somewhat scary or it hits you even slightly.
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