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Top pair @ FT of UB $500 vs Very Aggro Reg

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  1. jet5087 jet5087 is offline

    Posts: 271
    Joined: Mar 08

    Mar 31st, 2011 (3/31/2011 5:40am) in reply to The Spewtard

    deoxy ur entire argument is based off the fact that hes either 100% betting for value on the turn or hes 100% bluffing with no equity ..u say that the best way to extract max value is to just c/c each streeti n this situation, but look at all the combos of semi bluffs he can have on the turn that have good equity vs top pair. i havent even looked at the math to see if he should be b/c the turn with a fd but assuming hes not or if hes barreling just overs ur taking down the pot on the turn enough to make it a solid turn option..of course u can c/r the flop too but this is purely based on a turn decision
    846 1
  2. RenRad 01 RenRad 01 is offline

    Mexico

    Posts: 23
    Joined: May 06

    Apr 29th, 2011 (4/29/2011 5:56pm) in reply to jet5087

    shove pre! as played shove turn!
    70 1
  3. Jymaster0011 Jymaster0011 is offline

    Posts: 310
    Joined: Mar 09

    May 4th, 2011 (5/4/2011 9:44am) in reply to Deoxyribo

     
    Originally Posted by Deoxyribo View Post

    i mean, c/s turn is 100% NOT optimal. doing it just to avoid having to make a decision on the river is bad. thats like playing scared.
    c/s turn is not optimal in terms of getting value against his range which is mostly air, or draw type hands, period.
    if your gonna flat TJs OOP vs a very aggro, skilled and competant played you have to go with it if you flop top pair. once we have established that, its about extracting most value. there are 2 ways to get max value in the hand, check-raise the flop to induce a shove, or check and let him hang himself on every street.
    in this type of spot we want him to be the aggressor, we have a bluff catch hand against an oppenent that will be bluffing a lot. therefore we don't want to be the one moving all in, because that allows him to fold when he would have bluffed, or call with a better hand. and although he may call a shove with worse, he will most likely be ahead if he calls a shove.

    basically this is a spot where we need to be passive to get our aggressive villain to bluff, or we need to induce on the flop where we have a higher chance of getting shoved on

    also, for him b/c draws on the turn, idk the math because i havent looked or done it, but i doubt he will make a mistake and call without getting the right price with only one card to come

    I think a lot of times when someone check calls two streets on this board you know they aren't folding the river so as the bettor you get to play the river perfectly. You shove when you make your hand and you check when you don't. That's why shoving the turn in Frank's spot is probably best, because sixthsense will be bet/calling more draws than he will be bluffing with when he misses on the river.

    As for this hand I would probably shove pre but flatting seems fine too. Flop has to be a check/raise, get it in with this stack for sure tho.
    114 31
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