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tough spot at final table of stars NHG

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  1. lee118 lee118 is offline

    Charleston, SC
    United States

    Posts: 227
    Joined: Feb 07

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 8:11am)

    OK here is the situation. I am kinda on the short stack here with a few of other guys because my 99 lost to 88 for 2nd place chips or so. But anyways both villians in this pot have kinda made flats similar to this so I am not really worried about kk or aa. The villain who reraised me is a supernova and hasnt really gotten out of line to this point that I have seen. I want to know what people about this hand then I will give you my thoughts.

    pokerstars Game #52410371704: Tournament #339011041, $150+$12 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XX (3000/6000) - 2010/11/09 2:30:02 ET
    Table '339011041 68' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
    Seat 1: Ericb09 (219914 in chips)
    Seat 2: iloseflips24 (283482 in chips)
    Seat 3: pelky33 (715985 in chips)
    Seat 4: GRAPPA (360844 in chips)
    Seat 5: lee118 (154939 in chips)
    Seat 6: Kovalski1 (132617 in chips)
    Seat 7: boca2004 (131541 in chips)
    Seat 8: laburro (126628 in chips)
    Seat 9: joesid88 (151050 in chips)
    Ericb09: posts the ante 600
    iloseflips24: posts the ante 600
    pelky33: posts the ante 600
    GRAPPA: posts the ante 600
    lee118: posts the ante 600
    Kovalski1: posts the ante 600
    boca2004: posts the ante 600
    laburro: posts the ante 600
    joesid88: posts the ante 600
    Ericb09: posts small blind 3000
    iloseflips24: posts big blind 6000
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to lee118 [Qh Kd]
    pelky33: folds
    GRAPPA: folds
    lee118: raises 6005 to 12005
    Kovalski1: folds
    boca2004: calls 12005
    laburro: folds
    joesid88: folds
    Ericb09: calls 9005
    iloseflips24: folds
    *** FLOP *** [7c Qc 6d]
    Ericb09: checks
    lee118: bets 17155
    boca2004: raises 24845 to 42000
    Ericb09: folds
    lee118:
     
  2. Deoxyribo Deoxyribo is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
    United States

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    Joined: Jun 08

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 8:22am) in reply to lee118

    im shoving
     
  3. Wein Wein is offline Sunday Millionaire

    Posts: 9,189
    Joined: May 05

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 8:34am) in reply to Deoxyribo

     
    Originally Posted by Deoxyribo View Post

    im shoving

    yarp
     
  4. DrDankRx23 DrDankRx23 is offline

    West Palm Beach, FL
    United States

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    Joined: Dec 06

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 12:23pm) in reply to Wein

    I have no idea why this is tough spot. Not sure why anyone would think this is anything but a shove.
     1
  5. MastaP89 MastaP89 is offline

    Austria

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 1:09pm) in reply to Deoxyribo

     
    Originally Posted by Deoxyribo View Post

    im shoving

    hi
    1 
  6. TheSquid TheSquid is offline

    London
    United Kingdom

    Posts: 95
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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 1:17pm) in reply to MastaP89

    If your not worried about AA or KK then he's just repping sets.

    It's hard to flop a set.
    66 4
  7. nghtmronrvrstr nghtmronrvrstr is offline

    Hachenburg
    Germany

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    Joined: Nov 10

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 1:22pm) in reply to TheSquid

    tough spot for sure,think im folding,if they both havent gotten out of line its unlikely hes raising u with worse than KQ esp as shortstacked as he is himself.thats my opinion.
    tho if deoxy says hes shoving there it must be a shove
  8. okse54 okse54 is offline

    New York, NY
    United States

    Posts: 3,692
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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 2:12pm) in reply to nghtmronrvrstr

    it seems pretty meh boarderline to me, knowing villian has tendency to flat preflop i probably lean towards getting it in but folding isnt too bad.

    just bc he has flatted b4 doesnt mean we can take AA/KK out of his range, it just means its probably not just only AA/KK.

    his raise on the flop is like never a worse Q or lower pair. so his raising range probably consists of AA,KK,FDs,sets, maybe some straight draws if those are in his flatting preflop range, and possibly AQ as well. air might be in there i guess but i doubt we rly ever see air.

    theres also a chance that he shoves FDs and induces with the rest.

    we arent rly in the greatest shape vs that range of hands and ICM probably plays a role too

    now that i typed it out folding is starting to look better
     
  9. daphishermen daphishermen is offline

    Hoboken, NJ
    United States

    Posts: 427
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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 2:44pm) in reply to okse54

    Lol. wow.
    I have no fucking clue....

    Prob just end up folding.
     
  10. phyzer23 phyzer23 is offline

    Posts: 861
    Joined: Apr 07

    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 4:10pm) in reply to daphishermen

    he only starts the hand 22 bigs eff... and now hes put in 1/3 of his stack... really hard for him here to do it with worse than you like a pair w/ FD since he shouldnt really have any 6cXc in his range....also you dont have backdoor clubs... in the end the only hand i see you beating is like QJ (and I dont even know if he flats pre) or u chop with like KQ, but i really feel like he just turns over KK/AA
     
  11. Spraggs Spraggs is offline

    United Kingdom

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 4:32pm) in reply to phyzer23

    not easy, but looks like a fold from what you've said. player dependant though.

    EDIT: my explanation is that he has 20bbs.. u say he's not got out of line is supernova etc so SHOULD be capable (not always the case i know)

    It's nitty and im not sure i do it in real time, but i think if u were in this position 100 times vs this type of player, u would see AA and KK more than anything else.

    He'd more likely be shipping AQ pre, depending on ur range tho he could flat and that has to be in his range.

    is he rly flatting club hands here, AJcc is possible, but i dnt think connectors are highly likely. Same goes with 77 and 66, possible but not that likely.

    88, 99 and TT ship pre dont they? i just think ur beat.
    Edited By: Spraggs Nov 9th, 2010 at 04:57 PM
    341 
  12. Flopnuts1 Flopnuts1 is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 4:40pm) in reply to Spraggs

    I'd say FD shows up a lot here but AQ or sets are also within his range. Doubt he's doing this with air in a 3 way pot. This just really seems strong to me but I doubt I find a fold in the moment. If you fold you still have 20 bb left so that option is not out of the question. Gonna be hard to find better spots to get it in that TPGK though...
  13. pokerjamers pokerjamers is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
    United States

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 4:42pm) in reply to Flopnuts1

    kq bro cmon. click the call button. there is no folding kq in poker
    299 
  14. x_Driven_x x_Driven_x is offline

    Yorkville, IL
    United States

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 4:46pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    Iythink Your bet on the flop was too small. with ~ 47,000 in the pot 17,000 looks like you're trying to buy it cheap, I'd have raised you too.
    Should have been a a 30,000 bet or so. He probably noticed that and raised you.

    I'm re shoving here as played.

    shove > fold > call
  15. dude904 dude904 is offline

    North Wales, PA
    United States

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 5:28pm) in reply to x_Driven_x

    blizair goin to the hood
     
  16. Gags30 Gags30 is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 5:30pm) in reply to x_Driven_x

     
    Originally Posted by stang_racin View Post

    Iythink Your bet on the flop was too small. with ~ 47,000 in the pot 17,000 looks like you're trying to buy it cheap, I'd have raised you too.
    Should have been a a 30,000 bet or so. He probably noticed that and raised you.

    l


    hmmm...
    170 2 

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  17. Diggs Diggs is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 5:37pm) in reply to Gags30

    If villains a SN he should (in theory) know he can't profitably set mine so I would discount 66 and 77.

    AQ should be reshoving pre...

    I would be more worried of AA and KK than anything else.

    I shove here but am not really happy about it.
    Edited By: Diggs Nov 9th, 2010 at 05:40 PM
  18. Spraggs Spraggs is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 5:48pm) in reply to Diggs

     
    Originally Posted by Diggs View Post

    If villains a SN he should (in theory) know he can't profitably set mine so I would discount 66 and 77.

    AQ should be reshoving pre...

    I would be more worried of AA and KK than anything else.

    I shove here but am not really happy about it.

    copy me much?
    341 
  19. lee118 lee118 is offline

    Charleston, SC
    United States

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 6:45pm) in reply to Spraggs

    Thanks for all the replies. Here are my thoughts. I did end up folding this hand. The main reasons why I folded this hand were that he had not gotten in out of line at all before this spot. But the main reason that I folded that no one has really brought out in there explanation was there was a guy behind me when he made this raise and I just thought that was quite a bit stronger than if we were heads up. I think if we were just heads up I prolly say f it and get it in. Those are my thoughts but it was definitely a tough spot and thanks for all the responses
     
    Thread Starter
  20. Diggs Diggs is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 7:02pm) in reply to Spraggs

     
    Originally Posted by Spraggs View Post

    copy me much?

    lol not intentionally....just read the hand and gave my two cents without reading the replies.
  21. x_Driven_x x_Driven_x is offline

    Yorkville, IL
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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 7:45pm) in reply to Gags30

     
    Originally Posted by Gags30 View Post

    hmmm...

    Gags, don't make me second guess myself. :D LOL, actually I'd be interested in hearing if that hmmm... was a maybe I'm on the right track, or that maybe I actually haven't learned much when I thought I was improving. ha ha
  22. funnygut funnygut is offline gone hollywood

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 7:51pm) in reply to x_Driven_x

     
    Originally Posted by stang_racin View Post

    Gags, don't make me second guess myself. :D LOL, actually I'd be interested in hearing if that hmmm... was a maybe I'm on the right track, or that maybe I actually haven't learned much when I thought I was improving. ha ha

    not the first one

    hint: sizing your bets with the goal of making sure your opponent will not raise with air is, umm, pretty awful
     
  23. SlayNL SlayNL is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 9:44pm) in reply to TheSquid

     
    Originally Posted by TheSquid View Post

    It's hard to flop a set.

    Amen
  24. jmeow jmeow is offline

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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 10:52pm) in reply to pokerjamers

     
    Originally Posted by pokerjamers View Post

    kq bro cmon. click the call button. there is no folding kq in poker

    KQ doesn't lose.
  25. ZenEnso ZenEnso is offline

    AL
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    Nov 9th, 2010 (11/9/2010 11:14pm) in reply to jmeow

    You bet the perfect amount to fold if you don't like your hand and I think a fold is probably best BUT...what more are you looking for when you flop top pair with only a smidge over 20BB. I dont think shoving is horrible either. Bink the K on river. NH
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