Probably should be 3betting pre.... but as played wwyd??

pokerstars Game #44148894356: Tournament #311020006, $200+$15 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XI (150/300) - 2010/05/16 2:10:23 CET [2010/05/15 20:10:23 ET]
Table '311020006 6' 6-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: KidCardiff6 (25584 in chips)
Seat 2: PiKappRaider (27772 in chips)
Seat 3: DonkeyWrenn (6600 in chips)
Seat 4: 925rounder (23460 in chips)
Seat 5: BlackFourz (8515 in chips)
Seat 6: P0LAKO (16323 in chips)
KidCardiff6: posts the ante 40
PiKappRaider: posts the ante 40
DonkeyWrenn: posts the ante 40
925rounder: posts the ante 40
BlackFourz: posts the ante 40
P0LAKO: posts the ante 40
DonkeyWrenn: posts small blind 150
925rounder: posts big blind 300
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to KidCardiff6 [Kh Kc]
BlackFourz: folds
P0LAKO: raises 324 to 624
KidCardiff6: calls 624
PiKappRaider: folds
DonkeyWrenn: folds
925rounder: calls 324
*** FLOP *** [Jd 2s 9c]
925rounder: checks
P0LAKO: bets 794
KidCardiff6: raises 1451 to 2245
925rounder: calls 2245
P0LAKO: folds
*** TURN *** [Jd 2s 9c] [5h]
925rounder: checks
KidCardiff6: bets 3660
925rounder: raises 3891 to 7551
KidCardiff6: ??????????????????

check turn, call river, or bet if checked to??? idk im a nit. but as played i think i fold here even though your hand is very underrepped.

 

Originally Posted by leftygrove

Not many two pairs in his range (jack nine is probably the only one). I'm the spewy player that calls the turn and evaluates the river card.

Yeah by two pair I meant exactly J9. Pretty much I think he has to have J9, 22 or 99 or maybe AJ. I suppose he could have some sort of semi bluff straight draw but I just don't see it. What can he have that makes calling/re-evaluating river profitable?

 

Originally Posted by The Spewtard

This is an easy fold imo

this.

also ur def too deep not to be 3 betting

i would check back turn and call most river bets. seems a good way to control pot size vs a range that definitely weighs towards sets and induce bets from hands we could possible be ahead of like AJ or QT or sumthin. also i dont rly see the value in flatting a minraise this deep pre antes in a likely multiway pot. and like every1 else said fold as played

 

Originally Posted by bcdrmr

Benwa - Is there a reason you didn't 3bet pre?

Everyone - Fold sounds like the consensus but are we really letting go of KK here? He would have to have those specific hands in the bb... Personally I just lost 95% of my stack to him in this hand if he really really shows up w/ anything I'm beat by bc no way I can fold this without a soul read on him.

I'd have 3 bet pre for sure to isolate... and I'm shipping it in after he check raises the turn.

Flames likely but I'd prefer a little more thought process on why my play would be "bad". I'm really surprised to see everyone say fold here.

its bad to stack w KK here because we are crushed by the range of hands 925rounder/herbhealsme is possibly playing...he is usually not going to have random Jx or 9x like u might come across in micro stake mtts. after flop flat im ranging him like 22,99,jj,j9,qt,aj,AA, ugh thats proly even too wide but after turn raise its basically 22,99,jj,j9

Seems like a fold for sure.

 

Originally Posted by bcdrmr

I can see JJ/99 flatting from the bb... maayyyyyybe even the 22... just seems like a narrow range of specific hands, mostly PPs that the chances he's actually holding them seem low to me. obviously with each live card hitting the board it's one more PP that can set up but ugh...

Here's the thing I'm thinking: Wouldn't people be playing more aggressively at this level than donkament? answer is probably yes. but I probably just answered myself... they probably wouldn't be doing it on THAT dry of a board with air... right?

still shipping KK though... especially in my microments

i urge u to turn this thread into a learning experience

 

Originally Posted by bcdrmr

Benwa - Is there a reason you didn't 3bet pre?

Everyone - Fold sounds like the consensus but are we really letting go of KK here? He would have to have those specific hands in the bb... Personally I just lost 95% of my stack to him in this hand if he really really shows up w/ anything I'm beat by bc no way I can fold this without a soul read on him.

I'd have 3 bet pre for sure to isolate... and I'm shipping it in after he check raises the turn.

Flames likely but I'd prefer a little more thought process on why my play would be "bad". I'm really surprised to see everyone say fold here.

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I chose (mistakenly) to smooth pre flop. Villain had been opening alot and playing overly aggressive post, i would 90% of the time three bet here, but choose to flat in that it was likely somebody was going to 3bet behind with these table conditions and aggressive players behind.. obviously didnt work out and was rather hopeful... worst comes to worst i play him in position..
I ended up folding. i dont like checking behind on the turn here because i think a large range of his hands are just top pair, hes check calling the hand down.. and can extract alot of value here. I really don�t think he has many bluffs in his range either..
So was pretty confused when he check raises here.. but im fairly sure after reflecting he did indeed have 22, 99 or J9.. Which poses another question, say he has flopped a set here, has he misplayed his hand and thrown away the chance to stack me? How could he have played it differently?

 

Originally Posted by mtstackin88

i urge u to turn this thread into a learning experience

Should I be giving people more credit until they prove themselves otherwise unworthy?