I have been generally quite active at the table - I re-shoved 99s from the SB only 5hs before this one.
Dagobet had been tight since joining table only a few hands ago, but no real reads here. He did see me re-shove from the SB.
Kpy running at 25/25 after 24hs, so we can assume he is opening wide here.

Can we call here TTs here to induce re-shove behind from the shove/re-shove stacks and to play the pot IP post-flop?
What do you guys think of my ranging of Dagobert here:


equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 35.838% 34.58% 01.26% 26643532 970777.00 { TdTh }
Hand 1: 64.162% 62.90% 01.26% 48468594 970777.00 { TT+, AQs+, AKo }

With pot odds at 32%, this would make it a call. This is quite a conservative range, and even if I make it narrower it's still a marginal call. Out of interest, how many combos of AKo/AKs/AQs can he have here compared to JJs+?


pokerstars Hand #82123335041: Tournament #574830457, $2.00+$0.20 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XXI (800/1600) - 2012/06/18 17:03:06 WET [2012/06/18 12:03:06 ET]
Table '574830457 21' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: KpyTou 6O6P (78063 in chips)
Seat 3: Mércurial (44742 in chips)
Seat 4: Hoostenator (61301 in chips)
Seat 5: Dagobert6 (28472 in chips)
Seat 6: ripnik9 (18775 in chips)
Seat 7: GrindHeaps (36413 in chips)
Seat 8: plACEb0t (24455 in chips)
Seat 9: Mecrusse (48100 in chips)
KpyTou 6O6P: posts the ante 200
Mércurial: posts the ante 200
Hoostenator: posts the ante 200
Dagobert6: posts the ante 200
ripnik9: posts the ante 200
GrindHeaps: posts the ante 200
plACEb0t: posts the ante 200
Mecrusse: posts the ante 200
plACEb0t: posts small blind 800
Mecrusse: posts big blind 1600
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Mércurial [Th Td]
KpyTou 6O6P: raises 1679 to 3279
Mércurial: raises 4498 to 7777
Hoostenator: folds
Dagobert6: raises 20495 to 28272 and is all-in
ripnik9: folds
GrindHeaps: folds
plACEb0t: folds
plACEb0t is sitting out
Mecrusse: folds
KpyTou 6O6P: folds
Mércurial...

It's only a pair of tens, that's all it is, it isn't the Holy Grail. I remember a good semi pro I used to know saying exactly that about jacks when he was reraised by a good player. He folded. Only hand against a reasonable player you can beat is AKo, and that's only 11.5-10. You have 37,000 left from a stack of 44,742. Your opponent re raised a reraise. I think it unlikely AQ (either suited or unsuited) or JJ is in the range. AA KK QQ or AK are the four options with JJ and AQ as small possibilities. I'm folding like a deck chair unless I have a read on my opponent or know something about him to suggest he isn't a very good player, but even bad players get as many good hands as good players.

I folded QQ to a complete donk last year who reraised me preflop in the middle stages of a tourney. I am extremely tight, which makes it easier to get an idea of where I am, from the way other players react to me. He was a calling station donk but not a reraise donk. He had the same smirk on his face he had when he bet nuts hands. I folded QQ and showed, and he turned over KK with a complete look of amazement. One of the easier folds I've made.

The 3bet also depends on the dynamic you have with the opener and their 4bet frequencies. But like Reduce said..if its a bad table that will flat with a wide range of hands and shallower stacks its better to 3bet here to avoid a 3-5 multi way pot. If its an aggro/semi competent table that will look to shove 20+ bb's etc over a raise and a flat..then maybe flat more often.

Once you three bet its a pretty shitty spot, and a tough fold that I'm probably not making. This is a 2.20 FO but is the cold 4 better really going to be flatting/folding JJ here more than they are shoving? With the tightest range JJ+-Ak+ we have 33% equity..
Not the greatest with math so someone correct me if I'm wrong..but we need to call 20k more to win a 64k pot so we're getting 3.2-1 on a call...meaning we'd need 28% equity? vs cold 4bet range to justify a call. If thats the case the math says to call, but it's a pretty shitty spot.

 

Originally Posted by RedIceRap

i almost always call here to widen the ranges behind me. if an active player opens and u call, a lot of players behind u will see ur call as additional dead money and will shove/raise wider. i dont like ur 3bet because u clearly are far behind of a cold 4bet range and kinda price urself in to make a crying call. if u just call prolly every pocket pair and a lot of other hands will shove behind u, if the OR opens wide. especially given position ur 3bet looks like the nuts, but the problem is u wont get AQ+ and JJ+ to fold, u prolly fold out AJ from the first raiser and AQ from someone behind u but this is not a good enough reason to 3bet there.

not sure if that applies to a micro buy-in tourney tho. if the opener is stupid enough to set mine or makes similar horrible plays id prolly 3bet here much more, but even if he's bad u will win a lot of chips postflop by just calling in position, so either way overall i like to flat there preflop. but again, if the whole table just plays very bad and cant fold bad hands u could do anything but fold, even just 3bet shove to prevent many flatters behind u and "look like AK" to get like any pocket pair to call.

You make some good points here, and overall, calling with TTs seems to be the most +EV play. As played, we've put our self in a shitty spot where we probably can't fold. I like that by calling we can induce wider ranges to re-shove behind us (we widen our perceived range), and we get a good hand IP. Even if five players call behind us and the flop brings overs, we can just move on. In hindsight, I don't really like my 3bet as I had no real dynamics with the UTG opener, and I don't expect him to 4bet me light here. I thought really hard about this hand - I didn't have it in me to fold, but he's not shoving light here. Sure enough, I called and he showed KK. Picked up a lot from this thread though - thanks everyone.