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weird spot in 50r

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  1. pokerjamers pokerjamers is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
    United States

    Posts: 9,750
    Joined: Mar 06

    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:04pm)

    villain shoved hand before too.. he seemed to just fold down to his stack.. then shoved 2 straight hands.. do i just fold? im like almost 2:1 cl over 2nd at the time on the money bubble

    pokerstars Game #13928470537: Tournament #70319213, $50+$5 Hold'em No Limit - Level XIV (1000/2000) - 2007/12/17 - 18:54:30 (ET)
    Table '70319213 20' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
    Seat 1: o_x_e_n100 (61138 in chips)
    Seat 3: gambler2k4 (21928 in chips)
    Seat 4: Titantom32 (79832 in chips)
    Seat 5: maximum8282 (108282 in chips)
    Seat 6: kreiz (16198 in chips)
    Seat 7: pokerjamers (160572 in chips)
    Seat 8: amatos (56345 in chips)
    Seat 9: Stammdogg (17850 in chips)
    o_x_e_n100: posts the ante 200
    gambler2k4: posts the ante 200
    Titantom32: posts the ante 200
    maximum8282: posts the ante 200
    kreiz: posts the ante 200
    pokerjamers: posts the ante 200
    amatos: posts the ante 200
    Stammdogg: posts the ante 200
    gambler2k4: posts small blind 1000
    Titantom32: posts big blind 2000
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to pokerjamers [Jc As]
    maximum8282: folds
    kreiz: raises 13998 to 15998 and is all-in
    pokerjamers:
    299 
  2. threeven threeven is offline

    Tucson, AZ
    United States

    Posts: 18,612
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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:05pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    Im not rly folding this, tho his range is probably not actually that wide
    2
  3. kmil420 kmil420 is offline

    Los Altos, CA
    United States

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:09pm) in reply to threeven

    I think you are way ahead of his range. Only problem here is that you're acting so early. I'm definitely raising here to try to isolate that money in the middle, you have to be way ahead of his range.
  4. pokerjamers pokerjamers is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
    United States

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:12pm) in reply to kmil420

    yeah well I don't want to iso then have to call off another 30k-40k and stick 35bbs in with AJo
    299 
    Thread Starter
  5. jtown1010 jtown1010 is offline

    United States

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:12pm) in reply to threeven

    This looks like a call to me, but I agree that his range is probably pretty tight if he had been folding a lot with his stack and those blinds. I'd range him around 22+, Ax+, any 2 broadways, and a few random K9ss-J8ss type hands.
  6. threeven threeven is offline

    Tucson, AZ
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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:12pm) in reply to kmil420

    if the player has been tight, and just shoves two hands in a row, I wouldnt assume his range on the 2nd hand is wide. Often that 2nd shove is only going to be a decent hand at least. Usually people naturally play tighter after winning a pot ESPECIALLY the kind of player who has been v tight and mostly just folding his stack down.
    2
  7. tommpat2000 tommpat2000 is online now Chief Asshat

    Saint Paul, MN
    United States

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:13pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    agree there, plus why not keep the bubble going, it can only help you no?
  8. threeven threeven is offline

    Tucson, AZ
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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:13pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    ya, you know I dont think a fold would be terrible at all
    2
  9. gimmidaloot7 gimmidaloot7 is offline

    Toronto
    Canada

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:16pm) in reply to jtown1010

    LOL wp brag.....HUGE cl over 2nd place.........tiddddddddddddddddddddd!!!
  10. pokerjamers pokerjamers is offline

    Costa Mesa, CA
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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:18pm) in reply to threeven

    Yeah, I completely agree. fwiw, I was in between flatting and folding. I really think iso here is bad. maybe i'm wrong tho.
    299 
    Thread Starter
  11. jhill3535 jhill3535 is offline

    Russellville, AR
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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:33pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    From my experience (which is limited), if a player has no visible reason to be tilting, and is shoving between 6 and 15bb the second consecutive shove is a stronger hand than the first shove at least 90% of the time. The third straight shove is almost always a monster (which gets paid off alot more often than it should).

    Take this fwiw. If the initial shove is K9s+, A2+, 22+, the second shove is usually AJ+, 99+ and the third consecutive shove is usually QQ+, AK. I don't know if these are optimal shoving ranges, but it does make some sense considering each consecutive shove is ~2bb more than the previous one and usually with more people to act behind the shover, so his range should be tightening a little with each shove.
     
  12. rivverkiller rivverkiller is online now

    White Rock
    Canada

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    Dec 17th, 2007 (12/17/2007 6:41pm) in reply to jhill3535

    Flatting here may not actually be that bad. With the stacks of the players behind you, I think most players behind you will be folding not wanting to play pots with you. Your flat call in early position will also I think be a sign of strength, as if you're looking to encourage action behind you...

    Folding is not bad here either with that many players behind you.

    If I was to isolate, I'd probably just minraise. It gets your point accross while not committing too many chips...
     
  13. agriffrod agriffrod is offline 2010 WSOP #3 FT

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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 7:16pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    I fold. I might be a nit
     
  14. amak316 amak316 is offline

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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 7:27pm) in reply to agriffrod

    i fold too
     
  15. nemostars22 nemostars22 is offline

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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 7:49pm) in reply to amak316

    also
     
  16. shanetrain22 shanetrain22 is offline

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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 7:58pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    I'd fold. But if you flatted, that's def way better than isolating IMO.
     1
  17. TheWacoKidd TheWacoKidd is offline haters gonna hate

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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 8:25pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    a fold or a flat is just fine, depends on the tempo of the table behind you... iso is bad

    this one is so close I think it can't be answered on a forum
     1
  18. BerkeleyBoss BerkeleyBoss is offline

    Berkeley, CA
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    Dec 18th, 2007 (12/18/2007 8:48pm) in reply to pokerjamers

    fold>call>raise
     
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