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what to do with AK here ?

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  1. abakus73 abakus73 is offline

    Hamburg
    Germany

    Posts: 180
    Joined: Aug 09

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:04am)

    sorry I dont have the hand history here but I remember most important facts:

    I played a small field MTT with 30 ppl buyin of 100$ with a friend of mine...
    It was short handed and we both managed to get to the last 2 tables.
    I quit short b4 money and my friend got to FT and managed to get ITM.
    Prizes where: 1st 1150$ 2nd 750$ 3rd 460$ 4th 290$ 5th 220$
    The whole table was very inactive and all played very defensive as the
    following hand took place...
    My friend at 14k stack , shorty 8k , 2nd 17k and massive CL with 48k. The CL

    already raised some hands at blinds of 250/500 to 3 BB and all the time
    they all fold. My friend is in the BB with AK and the CL in SB makes it 1500
    again. He raises to 3k and gets and insta reraise all in from the CL....

    My thought here is CL has at least pockets an maybe KK or AA so an easy fold
    coz my friend has still good options to keep 11k left to get 3rd and options to
    get 2nd... he doesn't have to take this MAXIMUM coin.

    The outcome was he called it CL turns 1010 and he quit 4th :-(

    Now he says he had to call - A FOLD was absolute wrong here ....
    I see it different due to the stacks there...

    What would you say ?
  2. Drewch Drewch is offline

    Mississauga
    Canada

    Posts: 1,208
    Joined: Oct 05

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:08am) in reply to abakus73

    you didn't even say CL'ers position, but either way, instamacalll.
     
  3. Goldenad Goldenad is offline

    NJ
    United States

    Posts: 2,669
    Joined: Jun 06

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:08am) in reply to abakus73

    your friend needs to have a plan when he reraises with AK what hes going to do if the guy shoves. in this case he should be calling 100% of the time. if hes going to fold there, then why doesnt he just do it with 7-4 instead?

    do you understand that folding in this situation would turn AK into a bluff? you dont think its possible that the chipleader would be trying to bully the table around and possibly shoving sometihng like AQ amongst a wide range of other hands?

    long story short is, if youre going to fold AK in that spot when the guy shoves, you should just be flatting with it in the first place
     
  4. boris64 boris64 is offline

    Posts: 445
    Joined: Jun 09

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:09am) in reply to abakus73

    don't mess with the chip leader...

    tough fold at a FT, but you're flipping @ best

    i'd prbly shove instead of minraising in this case just cause of his stack size...
  5. aad aad is offline

    Detroit, MI
    United States

    Posts: 2,986
    Joined: Feb 08

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:25am) in reply to abakus73

    Open shove and as played: call.
  6. abakus73 abakus73 is offline

    Hamburg
    Germany

    Posts: 180
    Joined: Aug 09

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 9:28am) in reply to Drewch

     
    Originally Posted by Drewch View Post

    you didn't even say CL'ers position, but either way, instamacalll.

    its in my post "CL as SB makes it 1500" ...
    Thread Starter
  7. matze_widi matze_widi is offline

    Stuttgart
    Germany

    Posts: 1,695
    Joined: Jul 08

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 10:21am) in reply to abakus73

    def call 100% of the time..do u really think he is folding AQ,AJ, typ of hands to a almost minraise when he can be the bully with these hands.

    so if u raise u can´t ever fold here
     
  8. xxd33pxx xxd33pxx is offline

    Posts: 589
    Joined: Apr 06

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 11:14am) in reply to matze_widi

    dont ever fold.
    1
  9. mdshack14 mdshack14 is offline

    Auburn Hills, MI
    United States

    Posts: 5,646
    Joined: May 07

    Dec 16th, 2009 (12/16/2009 11:40am) in reply to boris64

     
    Originally Posted by boris64 View Post

    don't mess with the chip leader...

    tough fold at a FT, but you're flipping @ best

    i'd prbly shove instead of minraising in this case just cause of his stack size...

    No no.....this is not a race at best. If chip leader is any type of thinking player he knows that he can def use his stack vs your buddy to get him to fold. I'm sure getting it in vs the SB who happens to be the big stack with AK is def +EV. Also, like other replies have stated why 3 bet AK if you even are thinking of folding to a shove???
     
  10. abakus73 abakus73 is offline

    Hamburg
    Germany

    Posts: 180
    Joined: Aug 09

    Dec 17th, 2009 (12/17/2009 2:12am) in reply to mdshack14

     
    Originally Posted by mdshack14 View Post

    No no.....this is not a race at best. If chip leader is any type of thinking player he knows that he can def use his stack vs your buddy to get him to fold. I'm sure getting it in vs the SB who happens to be the big stack with AK is def +EV. Also, like other replies have stated why 3 bet AK if you even are thinking of folding to a shove???

    the problem I see here is that due to the prizeladder a fold makes sense coz
    the CL's insta reraise all in gives me the info he has at least a small pocket
    and this is maximum COIN if you call. so I say its still possible to fold to get
    a better situation to push all in instead of just calling and we still have 11k
    left - so more than shorty and still enough to caught 2nd with just 18k.
    I consider this fold only to have more outcome (money) at the end of the
    whole thing. nothing else....
    Thread Starter
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