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At what point do you shove rags UTG to maintain fold equity?

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  1. gunitkracker gunitkracker is offline

    Posts: 159
    Joined: Sep 08

    Dec 10th, 2008 (12/10/2008 8:24am)

    Just finished playing a final table, found myself without fold equity. this is hardly ever a problem for me, becasue i usually try to be pretty active at final tables. 6 handed, 1200/2400/300, i have about about average of 40k. i had folded about 8-10 hands in a row and alot of peoples open raises werent getting played back at, so i went for a UTG steal with 76ss. i get shoved on and have to fold. an orbit later i open from the CO with KJo, blind flat calls, flop rags, i c-bet/fold to a shove. im now down to about 27k. im looking for a good spot to open shove. for 3 rounds i dont get a card higher than a 9 and its never folded around to me in the sb or th button. the only times i could have open shoved and kept fold equity would have been UTG with complete rags. i had this opportunity of all 3 aforementioned orbits, but did not shove the garbage. i blinded down to about 19k when i get A3cc in the BB, sb minraises, i ship and hes priced in with 87o and i get knocked out. however, if i wouldve open shipped and stolen the blinds one of the previous 3 orbits, (with 7hi UTG), then i would have had enough chips to get the SB to fold his 87o. The question.... At what point do you shove rags UTG to maintain fold equity? if ever? thank you for inputs.
  2. 8888kush 8888kush is offline

    GA
    United States

    Posts: 1,497
    Joined: Mar 07

    Dec 10th, 2008 (12/10/2008 8:42am) in reply to gunitkracker

    When I am going to have less than 5 bbs deep after blinds are going to hit me.
  3. lordxixor101 lordxixor101 is offline

    Westland, MI
    United States

    Posts: 6,364
    Joined: Mar 06

    Dec 10th, 2008 (12/10/2008 8:55am) in reply to gunitkracker

    I'm wondering if you really didn't play this fine, and just got unlucky. No one is playing back at anyone, and then you make your raise (after not playing anything) and other players wake up with hands. Not only that, you can't get a real hand to save your life (but don't worry about it, if you did manage to get AA, it would have been in the BB, and you would have walked).

    Sounds like you played ok. If you want to shove absolutely nothing, would have picked a late spot where it was folded to you, but no guarantees there.

    Just a thought here, you shoved A3 with no fold equity. Since your not really itching for a call here (this isn't A10 in this spot where I'd want a hand like 87 to call), did you think about flatting/pushing any flop? Your hand is a slight favorite through 5 cards, you are a much stronger favorite through 3 (and even in some spots where you get a K107, he's ahead, yet might still fold his hand being ahead. Just a thought, far from full proof, but might have saved you here.

    From your story though, not a whole lot you can do.
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