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Why so many min-raises?

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  1. CallMeLucid CallMeLucid is offline

    Chico, CA
    United States

    Posts: 169
    Joined: May 08

    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 11:41am)

    Lately I have seen a LOT of minraising going on in the micro stakes sng's lately. sometimes from under the gun sometimes from the button when it is folded around to them. I am trying to understand this.

    When this happens to me, I like to put pressure on them and bump it up big when i have a decent hand. Sometimes they push all in from here, sometimes they just fold, and sometimes they just flat call and i dont know where i am at on the flop.

    how do you defend against this? this seems like the biggest donk move but no matter how much pressure i put on them, it turns around and bites me when the guy flips over kings or aces. should i just call their minraise?
  2. bonflizubi bonflizubi is offline

    Cambridge, MA
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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 12:19pm) in reply to CallMeLucid

     
    Originally Posted by CallMeLucid View Post


    how do you defend against this? this seems like the biggest donk move but no matter how much pressure i put on them, it turns around and bites me when the guy flips over kings or aces. should i just call their minraise?

    If they are turning up AA KK more often than not then bumping it big would seem to be the -EV choice?

    EDIT: If you have a big hand and bump it up---- have a plan. Be willing to go to the felt with it regardless... or know that you're willing to fold to the shove if you have the chips to do so. (That might be a spew.....but best to be cognizant of what is going on)

    Also, I've seen this in the stars streps I've been playing - especially the 4's ad 5's. With guys playing tight and the blinds mioving relatively fast, MOnsters are amost never getting 3x raises from the good players. 2x, 2.2, 2.5x especially when stacks are relatively even or raiser is a little short relative to blinds or average.

    I don't think it's jus the micro stakes.
     
  3. Fife19 Fife19 is offline

    Halifax
    Canada

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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 12:28pm) in reply to bonflizubi

    "Sometimes they push all in from here, sometimes they just fold, and sometimes they just flat call"

    Yep, those would be the options they have available.
  4. cds0699 cds0699 is offline

    Kearneysville, WV
    United States

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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 12:46pm) in reply to Fife19

    diaf min raisers, makes me wanna 3 bet the shit outta them.
  5. hans6555 hans6555 is offline

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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 12:53pm) in reply to cds0699

    I see that a lot too at stars. From UTG or UTG +1 a minimum raise is trouble. They are most likely holding AA or KK and want to see either 2 things.

    1. They want a lot of players going into the flop. Which is risky because the chance of two pair or trips, they then will bet big on the flop .

    2. They want to get re-raised and will either just call or move all in.
  6. CallMeLucid CallMeLucid is offline

    Chico, CA
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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 1:16pm) in reply to hans6555

    i also see this from the button when it is folded arouond to them too. i have shoved on them b4 and have been called down from anything from 88 to a9. the play is so random that its hard to tell when they are trying to steal with crap or if they are trying to trap
    Thread Starter
  7. A Bloomfield A Bloomfield is offline

    Clay Center, KS
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    Oct 25th, 2008 (10/25/2008 1:20pm) in reply to CallMeLucid

    Your playing micro stakes. Most of these players don't know what they're doing and they don't know what a standard raise is. They see their cards, they like em, so raise it up.

    Since these players like their hands and they're not good players it's going to be hard to get them off their hands pre flop. So basically your banging your head against the wall trying to push them off hands pre flop.

    You need to figure out what their raising range is, do they raise different amounts? I see a lot of players will put in mini raises with small pocket pairs, limp with big pocket pairs, and raise 3x, 4x, with hands they don't' want to get called with.

    Figure out what they're doing and try and out play them post flop. Forget about trying to get them off their hands pre flop.
  8. Carib Carib is offline

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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 12:15pm) in reply to A Bloomfield

     
    Originally Posted by A Bloomfield View Post

    Your playing micro stakes. Most of these players don't know what they're doing and they don't know what a standard raise is. They see their cards, they like em, so raise it up.

    Since these players like their hands and they're not good players it's going to be hard to get them off their hands pre flop. So basically your banging your head against the wall trying to push them off hands pre flop.

    You need to figure out what their raising range is, do they raise different amounts? I see a lot of players will put in mini raises with small pocket pairs, limp with big pocket pairs, and raise 3x, 4x, with hands they don't' want to get called with.

    Figure out what they're doing and try and out play them post flop. Forget about trying to get them off their hands pre flop.

    This is sooo very very true ... right on the money with this
  9. moman1965 moman1965 is offline

    Katy, TX
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 12:20pm) in reply to CallMeLucid

    Min raisers irk me to no end! Just last night, dude keeps min raising and calling all ins with j7o, etc. Here it comes again, min raise, I look down and see bullets and and reraise only to run into q7o. Of course the flop is q7x. GG me!! Just amazing how these people can't fold this crap!!
  10. sirswish6 sirswish6 is offline i mean super business

    Palatine, IL
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 2:21pm) in reply to CallMeLucid

    min 3 bet for info
    145 
  11. slapshot slapshot is offline

    Albany, NY
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 2:30pm) in reply to sirswish6

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    2. Min raisers NEVER FOLD.

    3. NEVER BLUFF a min raiser (because of #2).

    4. Fast play the hell out of big hands against a min raiser (also because of #2).

    KILL MIN RAISERS.

    gl.
  12. sirswish6 sirswish6 is offline i mean super business

    Palatine, IL
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 2:39pm) in reply to slapshot

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    2. Min raisers NEVER FOLD.

    3. NEVER BLUFF a min raiser (because of #2).

    4. Fast play the hell out of big hands against a min raiser (also because of #2).

    KILL MIN RAISERS.

    gl.

    i wish the world was flat so you could fall off
    145 
  13. slapshot slapshot is offline

    Albany, NY
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 2:45pm) in reply to sirswish6

    It is flat, you donk. Go min raise something.

    http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society
  14. Counting Bodies Counting Bodies is offline

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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 3:48pm) in reply to slapshot

    personally i've declared it FUCK MINI RERAISE PREFLOP MONTH. I'm giving this retarded play no respect and shoving every damn time. Not sure if this is even what you're talking about but i hate it and am sick of thinking this is AA/KK/QQ
     
  15. NeverScaredB NeverScaredB is offline

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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 4:08pm) in reply to slapshot

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    B...b...but...I do this. :'< I guess I'm a huge donk.
    289 2 
  16. slapshot slapshot is offline

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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 4:43pm) in reply to NeverScaredB

    btw, my min raise bashing is against PRE-FLOP min raisers.
  17. slapshot slapshot is offline

    Albany, NY
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 4:48pm) in reply to NeverScaredB

     
    Originally Posted by NeverScaredB View Post

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    B...b...but...I do this. :'< I guess I'm a huge donk.

    Well you're a winning player, so I suppose you're a rare exception (kind of like all players with baby pics are huge donks with the one exception of Bax).

    Are you really a min raiser? Like pre-flop min raiser from Level 1 blinds all the way to the final table? I don't see how that's possible. Serious question.
  18. CallMeLucid CallMeLucid is offline

    Chico, CA
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 4:55pm) in reply to slapshot

    my favorite is an utg min raise followd by 7 calls... build a pot to 460 or so then like 2-4 all-ins on the flop lol.
    Thread Starter
  19. j_farah j_farah is offline

    Mississauga
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 5:29pm) in reply to CallMeLucid

    Nothing puts me on tilt more than the min-raise from the BB after a bunch of limpers. I have yet to see why anyone would think that's a good play.
    Almost as bad is the min-reraise of the min-raise. Especially if the original raiser decides to min-reraise again once it gets back to him. And I'm not talking limit games here.

    If I see anyone doing these moves, I'm noting them as a donk.
  20. NeverScaredB NeverScaredB is offline

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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 9:27pm) in reply to slapshot

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

     
    Originally Posted by NeverScaredB View Post

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    B...b...but...I do this. :'< I guess I'm a huge donk.

    Well you're a winning player, so I suppose you're a rare exception (kind of like all players with baby pics are huge donks with the one exception of Bax).

    Are you really a min raiser? Like pre-flop min raiser from Level 1 blinds all the way to the final table? I don't see how that's possible. Serious question.

    No, not then. Typically between 15-20 BBs from all positions I am min raising unless I am shoving.
    289 2 
  21. deezy5821 deezy5821 is offline

    Lawrenceville, GA
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    Oct 27th, 2008 (10/27/2008 9:32pm) in reply to slapshot

     
    Originally Posted by slapshot View Post

    1. Insta note any min raiser as a HUGE DONK (if you're reading this and are a min raiser, then yes you are a HUGE DONK and I guarantee you have one of those fishbowl pics next to your name on Sharkscope).

    2. Min raisers NEVER FOLD.

    3. NEVER BLUFF a min raiser (because of #2).

    4. Fast play the hell out of big hands against a min raiser (also because of #2).

    KILL MIN RAISERS.

    gl.

    ^^^^^^

    This should seriously start being published in the newer poker books coming out
     
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