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Would you take this spot?

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  1. RedIceRap RedIceRap is offline Redirator

    Germany

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    Joined: Jun 10

    Mar 28th, 2012 (3/28/2012 7:06pm)

    pokerstars Hand #77955583556: Tournament #566010443, $100+$9 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (40/80) - 2012/03/28 19:51:48 CET [2012/03/28 13:51:48 ET]
    Table '566010443 14' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
    Seat 1: WhiteRabbito (2840 in chips)
    Seat 2: RedIceRap (3334 in chips)
    Seat 3: Roma-Tilt (2421 in chips)
    Seat 4: sjaak2afhaak (1249 in chips)
    Seat 5: hulil (4480 in chips)
    Seat 6: Parampampero (3497 in chips)
    Seat 7: habsfan3003 (2669 in chips)
    Seat 8: EMPTY1SEAT (1911 in chips)
    Seat 9: baluba53 (4169 in chips)
    WhiteRabbito: posts the ante 10
    RedIceRap: posts the ante 10
    Roma-Tilt: posts the ante 10
    sjaak2afhaak: posts the ante 10
    hulil: posts the ante 10
    Parampampero: posts the ante 10
    habsfan3003: posts the ante 10
    EMPTY1SEAT: posts the ante 10
    baluba53: posts the ante 10
    sjaak2afhaak: posts small blind 40
    hulil: posts big blind 80
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to RedIceRap [4d 4s]
    Parampampero: raises 121 to 201
    habsfan3003: folds
    EMPTY1SEAT: folds
    baluba53: folds
    WhiteRabbito has timed out
    WhiteRabbito: folds
    WhiteRabbito is sitting out
    WhiteRabbito has returned
    RedIceRap: calls 201
    Roma-Tilt: raises 2210 to 2411 and is all-in
    sjaak2afhaak: folds
    hulil: folds
    Parampampero: folds
    RedIceRap: folds
    Uncalled bet (2210) returned to Roma-Tilt
    Roma-Tilt collected 813 from pot
    Roma-Tilt: doesn't show hand
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 813 | Rake 0
    Seat 1: WhiteRabbito folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 2: RedIceRap folded before Flop
    Seat 3: Roma-Tilt (button) collected (813)
    Seat 4: sjaak2afhaak (small blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 5: hulil (big blind) folded before Flop
    Seat 6: Parampampero folded before Flop
    Seat 7: habsfan3003 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 8: EMPTY1SEAT folded before Flop (didn't bet)
    Seat 9: baluba53 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

    I need about 42%, i stoved it and get a bit better than that (43-44%). however, i folded (before i stoved of course) because this seemed to be a bit too close and cause of my playable stack. are there players who say that this is a call here? if not, how much equity do u need here to call? for example, 55 has 46% and 66 has about 48% here, would you call? i call with 77+ all day but feel like im folding too much in similar spots with hands that i (maybe) should call with.

    i of course have a bit of history with villain and think he squeezes any pocket and a buncha flips here, opener was kinda LAG so i doubt villain was worried about his hand.
    Edited By: RedIceRap Mar 28th, 2012 at 07:14 PM
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  2. gjallen1975 gjallen1975 is offline

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    Mar 28th, 2012 (3/28/2012 7:11pm) in reply to RedIceRap

    seems like an EZ fold to me. jams like that tend to be 88 - QQ more often than 22,33, AK, AQ.
  3. RedIceRap RedIceRap is offline Redirator

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    Mar 28th, 2012 (3/28/2012 7:19pm) in reply to gjallen1975

    this is actually not a question about this hand in particular. it's about how much equity do i need to call here with my playable stack ASSUMING the range i gave him is right. i think there are players who take EVERY +ev and are successful, other players say dont take every spot. and what does 'more often' mean? either i put the hands in a certain player's range or i dont.
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  4. tyson219 tyson219 is offline Moderator

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    Mar 29th, 2012 (3/29/2012 1:00am) in reply to RedIceRap

    I pass. I think really early in tournaments it's okay to pass on super marginal +EV spots. One reason is that there are generally more bad players as well as more players willing to gamble, so accumulating chips is a bit easier. Second, close spots like that are so dependent on an accurate range. If you're a little off, you could have 39% equity instead of 44% and it turns into spew instead of a very marginal +cEV play.
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  5. RedIceRap RedIceRap is offline Redirator

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    Mar 29th, 2012 (3/29/2012 3:45am) in reply to tyson219

    Ty tyson. Yes that was a rather easy and standard fold. Just made think a bit and made ask myself questions like 'what would i call with, what would i snap call with, etc' and i didnt really knew the answers. Is it even better to fold 88/AJ and worse? Think i cant find a fold with 99+ and AQ+ here. Because i think this particular player has a very wide range there i also wouldnt find a fold with 77.

    And yeah 77 has like 48% or so, so even if the range i gave him is a bit off this is a +cEV call, but is this one of these 'i gonna find better spots' or should i always call here if i get the right pot odds and am sure that this gonna be a +cEV call? I mean, if someone shoves every hand at the start of a tourney i also wont call with Q8 just because it's an above avg hand... That's an extreme example tho.
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  6. David Whats David Whats is offline

    United Kingdom

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    Mar 29th, 2012 (3/29/2012 10:44am) in reply to RedIceRap

    IMHO, you still have healthy enough stack to play if you fold. This early in tourney, I think your life in the tourney is worth more than the gains you get with the slightly +ev play of calling. On the other hand, maybe that's one of my leaks, maybe i should take these slightly +ev plays to build a stack earlier on in tourneys?
  7. Bisull Bisull is offline

    Iceland

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    Joined: Mar 08

    Mar 29th, 2012 (3/29/2012 6:57pm) in reply to David Whats

    Just a little too marginal these spots pre antes (44-77-AJ), i'd def give it some thought if this were w antes

    There was a thread in the training forum about taking every +ev spot but that didnt get much love as is usual in that forum, i'd be interrested to hear what the sickos have to say about that
     
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