Poker Discussion Post

 
Sign in | Join
in
Bodog
$100K Guaranteed
Every Sunday! 
Sign Up Today!
Rakeback
Get cash back after
playing poker!
Sign up now!
CarbonPoker 
$15,000 Rake Chase
Plus 30% Rakeback!
Cake Poker 
33% Rakeback
$25k extra each month!

Poker Discussion


Please help support pocketfives by using our links when choosing to download a new site!
CarbonPoker · Full Tilt · Cake Poker · PokerStars · Ultimate Bet · Players Only · Bodog

   

a little fuzzy on pokerstars steps sng strategy...PLZ HELP
ucftennis12 (United States) 19 Posts. Joined 11-21-2006.
09-16-2008 11:22 PM

3 handed in step 5, top two get ticket to step 6:

PokerStars Game #20468691178: Tournament #108668708, $670+$30 Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (150/300) - 2008/09/17 0:10:12 ET
Table '108668708 1' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 2: -ispender-55 (4025 in chips)
Seat 6: ucftennis12 (5870 in chips)
Seat 7: TheC@T (3605 in chips)
-ispender-55: posts the ante 25
ucftennis12: posts the ante 25
TheC@T: posts the ante 25
ucftennis12: posts small blind 150
TheC@T: posts big blind 300
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ucftennis12 [Ad 8s]
-ispender-55: raises 3700 to 4000 and is all-in
ucftennis12: ?


help?
 
 
 

computerb (United States) 10,172 Posts. Joined 03-23-2006.
09-16-2008 11:25 PM - In reply to

You got your money in good. If you don't post the results I'm sure Jennifear or another sng expert will tell you the correct strategical play. By showing the results this looks very much like a bad beat.


dpottz (United States) 10,762 Posts. Joined 04-05-2006.
09-16-2008 11:34 PM - In reply to

 at first glance i'd fold


iTakeUALLin (United States) 299 Posts. Joined 06-16-2006.
09-16-2008 11:37 PM - In reply to

ez fold


dpottz (United States) 10,762 Posts. Joined 04-05-2006.
09-16-2008 11:38 PM - In reply to

 yea its definitely a fold


http://www.holdemresources.net/hr/sngs/icmcalculator.html?action=calculate&bb=300&sb=150&ante=25&structure=0.5%2C+0.5&s1=4025&s2=5870&s3=3605&s4=&s5=&s6=&s7=&s8=&s9=


ucftennis12 (United States) 19 Posts. Joined 11-21-2006.
09-16-2008 11:40 PM - In reply to

can you explain a little more thoroughly please? i understand sng strategy to a point that i should be shoving every hand cuz i have the chip lead, blah blah. but i feel like the other 2 players are even and are both playing to get in the top 2 spots so they arent gonna like just be autofolding k hi, etc even if im jus shoving every hand. maybe my reasoning is extremely flawed, im not sure. a more in depth explanatio would help, ty.


stevie444 (United Kingdom) 1,442 Posts. Joined 01-16-2007.
09-16-2008 11:43 PM - In reply to

snapfold


dpottz (United States) 10,762 Posts. Joined 04-05-2006.
09-16-2008 11:53 PM - In reply to

ucftennis12: 

can you explain a little more thoroughly please? i understand sng strategy to a point that i should be shoving every hand cuz i have the chip lead, blah blah. but i feel like the other 2 players are even and are both playing to get in the top 2 spots so they arent gonna like just be autofolding k hi, etc even if im jus shoving every hand. maybe my reasoning is extremely flawed, im not sure. a more in depth explanatio would help, ty.



what exactly do you mean? no one is assuming how tight they'll be folding later. this hand, in a vacuum, is a fold because what you stand to win isn't worth the risk. even if he's shoving optimally (and i'll bet a lot of people are tighter than that), A8o is def def def def a fold

NeverScaredB (Canada) 847 Posts. Joined 07-29-2008.
09-16-2008 11:53 PM - In reply to
20

Let's say hypothetically the stacks were all exactly even. In this case, everyone would have exactly 1/3rd equity in the prize pool. If you called and won here, you would not get 2/3rds the equity in the prize pool; instead, you would get 1/2, a gain of 1/6th. If you called and lost, you would lose 1/3rd of the prize pool. Thus, you need at least a 66% edge over an opponent's range (before correcting for pot odds) to make a call if the stacks are even. While you get a little more leeway for not losing 100% of your equity when you call, A8o is still only 60% against a random hand.

 

I'm too lazy to run the hard math, but if ispender is pushing 100% of hands here, this is probably close. If he's pushing 50% of hands (this includes gems like K5o and J4s), it's a fold. So unless you have a good reason to suspect this player is a complete moron, fold.


Jennifear (United States) 9,061 Posts. Joined 11-01-2005.
09-16-2008 11:57 PM - In reply to

Should you decide to fold:

Player Chips Prob 1st Prob 2nd Prob 3rd Chance of a Top Two Spot 
ispender
4525 0.3352 0.3521 0.3127 69%
Hero
5695 0.4219 0.3481 0.2301 77%
thecat
3280 0.2430 0.2998 0.4573 54%


Should you call, and win, you win a ticket (+23% compared to folding)

Should you call, and lose, your chances of getting the seat drop to 40% (-37% compared to folding):

Player Chips Prob 1st Prob 2nd Prob 3rd Chance of a Top Two Spot
ispender
8375 0.6204 0.2973 0.0823 92%
Hero
1845 0.1367 0.2672 0.5961 40%
thecat
3280 0.2430 0.4355 0.3215 68% <<<this is where your lost equity is going


So, you risk 37% to win 23%.  To break even you must win 37/60 (61.7%) of the time to counter that risk:

Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
A8o 59.87% 14,693,282,100 754,345,548
Random hand 40.13% 9,723,241,152 754,345,548


Even if he is shoving any two cards, this is a fold.

Hope that helps!


ucftennis12 (United States) 19 Posts. Joined 11-21-2006.
09-17-2008 12:00 AM - In reply to

thanks


Maridu (Brazil) 4,009 Posts. Joined 11-22-2006.
09-17-2008 12:02 AM - In reply to

stevie444: 

snapfold



whatever he says is correct
 
Return to Top
Page 1 of 1 (12 items)


P5's Member Blogs
Free Poker Coaching (I Ne...
By Cre8ive - added Nov 18 2009, 02:38 AM
Relationships and Poker
By dtools22 - added Nov 16 2009, 12:15 PM
A Victory and Playing wit...
By sgildea25 - added Nov 16 2009, 12:49 PM
 
Joe Cada is our guest this week!  The newest WSOP Main Event Champion answers questions from P5s viewers.

P5s Podcast, Nov 19, 2009
Thur, 19 Nov 2009 12:00:00 EST
Jon 'apestyles' Van Fleet is back on the podcast this week to talk about the latest in his poker career.

P5s Podcast, Nov 12, 2009
Thur, 12 Nov 2009 12:00:00 EST
PocketFives.com Rankings
Rank PLB PRO
1. gboro780 3 1
2. djk123 1 3
3. Jovial Gent 2 4
4. moorman1 8 2
5. Doc Sands 5 6
6. rock3656 6 8
7. govshark2 7 7
8. ImaLuckSac 11 9
9. badpab2 4 19
10. brainwash 10 16
Carbon Poker Sorting Tables
Rank PLB
 1. djk123 9022.06
 2. Jovial Gent 8103.48
 3. gboro780 8046.07
 4. rock3656 7746.87
 5. govshark2 7645.73
 6. brainwash 7528.39
 7. 1SickDisease 7466.88
 8. ImaLuckSac 7369.79
 9. hoodini10 7327.57
 10. HITTHEPANDA 7271.41
Go