Poker Discussion
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CarbonPoker · Full Tilt · Cake Poker · PokerStars · Ultimate Bet · Players Only · Bodog
So this took place on 6-10-2007:
I was railing a buddy of mine and chatting with him on AIM one sunday evening as he was getting deep in the full tilt poker 215 buy in 400k guaranteed tournament. He was playing extrordinary and was poised to make a deep run. At this point in time, i believe there were approximately 3-4 tables left so somewhere in the 27-36 players range. If i recall correctly, my buddy had a top 5 stack, and possibly even top 3. This was some time ago, so forgive me but a few of the details may be a bit foggy. Let it be known that my buddy was not staked in this tournament by the player in question so the overwhelming comment of people taking over their stakee's accounts is a null and void point. Out of nowhere around this point of the tournament, SpanishKey, also known here on P5's as Aaron Been came on the rail asking my buddy if he had AIM. My buddy didn't respond. SpanishKey was persistant, and after a few attempts at asking him if he had AIM, my buddy finally responded something along the lines of "no, but PM me on P5s if you want to talk." I was pretty interested to see what was so urgent, and i was happy that my buddy was filling me in. Aaron Been on the PM in a nutshell asked my buddy for an undisclosed amount of money (meaning i didnt ask how much he offered) to purchase his account for the rest of the tournament. My buddy on AIM was like, WTF, and basically took this as a slap in the face. My friend was a ranked player at that time, and was fully confident in his skills to take the tournament down on his own, and felt like he would be giving up alot of equity to sell off his account. He denied Mr. Been the invitation and went on to final table this tournment for a very nice 5 figure score.
I guess my point of this is a couple of things. It is very naive to think that this is only going on amongst a few players. This issue may be WAAAAAAAAY more widespread than we think. This is just one example of an attempted cheat attempt gone wrong. Now, I am not positive that it was Aaron Been (SpanishKey) that was gonna take the account over, or one of his close associates, but i am 100% positive that he had entered this tournament himself as there is a record of it in the Pokerdb in which Aaron finished in 2735/2765. I am also 100% positive that it was the SpanishKey account soliciting my friend, and I am sure if Pocket Fives holds PM records that this message was sent and recieved by my friend.
I will/would be very curious to see if Aaron Been comes here to respond to this, and maybe clear the air as to what exactly was going on that day. There is no excuse on this one that he was trying to help him through some "sticky situations." This was an outright attempt to purchase someone's account. I guess I am not savvy on all the rules and technicallities of the online poker sites, but this has to be not tollerated, and i commend my buddy and give him mad props to deny this attempt and play the tournament on his own, and give him alot of credit for placing highly in a sunday major final table out of almost 3000 players.
MJ P.I.
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Exactly how are you going to know if this is the case or not?, Everybody that wins a tourney now thats NOT a ranked player, gets a cavity search?? wtf are you guys smoking?
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IMO the more I hear about this the more props I give to players like brsavage, waco, menlo, annette, mattg, atimos and all the other sickos who are making such $$$ legit because it seems to me that for every tourney they win they have to go through other great players who have no morals anything up to 4 times!! In my mind that's insane and for those who say JJ is the best player ever, i ask u this: In how many tourneys has he beaten a great player 4 times? Because every tourney the players above have won it seems they've beaten him multiple times!!!
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All of this is screwed up. You can be playing against 2 people 3
people a whole fucking room of people, different people at different
stages of tournament?? LOL WTF. But what are you going to do about?
This is not enforceable, it is impossible to stop this. It is what it
is. It is hard for the average/decent winning player b/c they got no
shot against collaborating pros. lol. I guess online poker is rigged.
-buk
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I'm gonna continue to try really hard to just play honestly and not concern myself with any of this, but it's gettin scarier/sadder every day . = (
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he is talking about a group of friends who are all backed by the same guy, not like some big cheating ring... I'm assuming he means timex and his 2+2 clan
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It's people like you I feel the most sorry for. All you sickos must have had 6 figures stolen from you in equity by JJ and his pos crew.
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please add me to the list of players who play one account , thanks
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"Whenever I'm playing against one of the guys from the group Matt is talking about" (Aaron been)
"I didn't know I was playing against a group"
Seems to me to be at least a couple of groups of ranked players working
together, the only one I know of at the moment being the JJ, YTIU,
Mantis, Aaronbeen crowd...
I don't think I have a problem with buying out someone else's account
late on, because it is basically a bussiness proposition with risk and
reward....The seller gets guaranteed monetary compensation, and the pro
has to deal with the risk that he might bust and and make a loss on his
investment...
This is shady though cause in this case Aaron had already been in the
tourney under his own account...In this case he busted early but I
suspect if they are willing to push the system to the edge like this
then it would not be beyond them to buy someone else's account while
still in the tourney under a different account...
And mattg, if he did start bragging to you afterwards, thats really uncool and I think you should out the people involved...
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With all the scrutiny on online poker right now, this is just what the poker world needs. I don't think these guys realize that what they are doing is ruining our shot at continuing to be able to log on and play cards from the confines of our house.
I wonder if they realize what it is like to not to be able to pick up thousands of dollars a day from playing a game. From what I've read on these forums several of these guys have dropped out of school, quit jobs etc to play poker. No back up skills for them to earn a living outside of clicking a mouse. I know this isn't the case for all of the cheaters but some I'm sure have no idea what it takes to provide for themselves and their family in the real world. After the moral police decide to completely shut this game down because of all the shadiness all I will have to say to these morons is:
I would like that supersized please with a chocolate shake
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Pupkin
(United States)
1,820
Posts.
Joined
11-30-2005.
08-18-2007 2:02 PM
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In reply to
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I don't give a crap if this stuff isn't illegal or expressly forbidden -- it's cheating to me, plain and simple, and it hugely tarnishes how I feel about online poker in general. I try (unsuccessfully) for a couple years to be a successful poker player in this world and I see it as this cool, worthy goal, and I'm definitely not saying that these players are bad at poker or that I'm anywhere near better than them (like many other people are stupidly saying), but I'm just saying that it makes the whole thing seem like a less important goal. Obviously good honest players can still profit in this system and profit a lot, and I can't even do that consistently, but stuff like this makes me just not even want to try, and I think a lot of other people feel the same way.
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Stick to the baseball dude, you seem good at that at least!
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I have to disagree that buyig someone's seat deep in a tournament is nothing like playing multiple accounts. One would play multiple accounts to increase there chances of getting deep and has an advantage over those playing just one seat. Buying someone's seat is pretty much the same thing only you're paying a higher "Buy In" price for your second seat because you get to choose the seat that is already deep and has chips.
I play mostly $3-10 tourneys and my winnings are probably less than the price I'd get for selling a seat I had deep. But reading these posts, I now wonder if I had fallen victim to a seat purchaser. A few years ago, I was lucky enough to win a satellite into a $25,000 WPT Seat satellite where I found myself the chip leader 3 handed for the $25,000 WPT Championship Seat. I admit a few years ago I was a much bigger donk than I am now and didn't really understand the end game startegy and got outplayed. Howerver, I vividly remember the player on my left completely changing gears and was re-raising me evertime I bet and totatlly abused me, this really stuck out becaues I was like wow...this guy totatlly changed gears on me and by the time I adjusted it was too late.
Maybe I got outplayed because he adjusted, but maybe he "became" a much better player and if that was the case would piss me off. Would this be fair for someone to buy a seat here in this satellite? I don't think so.
How would you like to be at the Final Table of the WSOP Main event with 17 unknowns at the final two tables, make the final table and discover that they are now playing like Phil Ivey, Allen Cunningham, Doyle Brunson, Imper1um, JohnnyBax, and Annette_15, etc although they look like the same people -- I know, some of you will say online poker is different than live poker, but some things should be the same. If you can't buy a seat live, you shouldn't be able to buy a set online -- just as AA should continue to be greater than KK online just as it is live too.
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^^^^^^^
Bingo!
The moral integrity of these "individuals" astounds me. This is like saying since their is no law against balling my neighbors wife it is okay for me to do so.
The only way for these people to be stopped is for the online poker community to take a stand and keep the pressure on them to stop. The problem seems to be that way to many people have no issue with this shit and/or are participating in this kind of activity.
It almost gets to the level of organized crime with this JJ character being the John Gotti of the underground poker world which is why the post by jack ace is right on the mark. You don't think that all of this shit doesn't feed right into the people who are looking to band online poker? You don't think something like this doesn't have the possibility to affect online poker throughout the world?
It may sound far fetched but there is enough money to be made that I wouldn't be surprised if more shady dealings such as this continue to be exposed.
So, you want to buy a piece of the action? How about I give you 18% of my foot in your ass!
#s
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